Standard way of expressing 'no proof given'?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the conventions of providing proofs in mathematical writing, particularly when a statement is considered 'obvious' or derived from inspection. Participants explore how to express the lack of a formal proof while maintaining clarity and brevity in communication.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants suggest that phrases like "it is obvious that..." can be used, but caution that one must ensure the statement is genuinely obvious.
  • Others argue that simply trying a few examples or using a calculator does not constitute a proof, referencing complex conjectures like the Collatz Conjecture as an example.
  • A participant mentions that stating "by inspection" is acceptable, as it allows the reader to verify the claim, but it does not imply a complete proof.
  • Another participant humorously notes that a common strategy among students is to label something as "trivial" to gain credit, despite the complexity of the proof.
  • Several participants share anecdotes about instructors using casual phrases to describe proofs, highlighting a cultural aspect of mathematical communication.
  • There is a discussion about the appropriateness of certain expressions and the evolution of language in mathematics, with some reflecting on past phrases that may be considered outdated or inappropriate today.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the necessity of providing proofs for statements deemed 'obvious' or derived from inspection. Multiple competing views remain regarding acceptable expressions and the implications of brevity in mathematical writing.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include the subjective nature of what is considered 'obvious' and the potential for varying interpretations of brevity and clarity in mathematical proofs.

Jehannum
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In a proof of a theorem or in mathematical writing generally, if there is a statement of a sub-theorem, does a proof always need to be given if 'obvious' or if obtained by inspection? Is there a way of saying "I got this by trying some numbers in a calculator and the pattern was clear"?

The motivations are brevity, clarity and keeping to the main point.
 
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Jehannum said:
In a proof of a theorem or in mathematical writing generally, if there is a statement of a sub-theorem, does a proof always need to be given if 'obvious' or if obtained by inspection? Is there a way of saying "I got this by trying some numbers in a calculator and the pattern was clear"?
That wouldn't be a proof. For example, you cannot prove the Colaltz Conjecture just be trying a few starting numbers:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Collatz_conjecture

Or, more famously, Fermat's last theorem.
 
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You can find "it is obvious that..." but make sure it's really obvious. Looking at a few examples isn't enough.
 
mfb said:
You can find "it is obvious that..." but make sure it's really obvious. Looking at a few examples isn't enough.
There is the old joke about the mathematics professor who goes to the blackboard writes down a few equations, and says "it is obvious that...". Then he pauses, scribbles furiously for twenty minutes and finally continues "yes, it is indeed obvious".
 
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I had a calculus instructor years ago who had these pat phrases:
"The proof is obvious to the most casual observer."
"Even my own mother could do this integral."
 
Mark44 said:
I had a calculus instructor years ago who had these pat phrases:
"The proof is obvious to the most casual observer."
"Even my own mother could do this integral."
Hopefully, that sort of casual sexism is a thing of the past!
 
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This was in the age before rampant PC... To be honest, my mother was not able to do those integrals.
 
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Mark44 said:
This was in the age before rampant PC... To be honest, my mother was not able to do those integrals.
Nor is mine. But, the last time I visited her she was translating Immensee by Theodor Storm from a German edition written in gothic script!
 
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Jehannum said:
Is there a way of saying "I got this by trying some numbers in a calculator and the pattern was clear"?
Yes, if you have tried this 100 times you could say that "the table in Appendix A shows 100 (biased) sample inputs and the corresponding results; from these results the following relation was hypothesised" however this doesn't have anything to do with proof.
 
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We had a freakishly smart grad student grader once. The joke we told was that if you got lost in a proof just say ”trivially.” The grader would get to the comment, think a moment, say “yes, that is trivial” and give you credit.
 
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  • #11
Jehannum said:
In a proof of a theorem or in mathematical writing generally, if there is a statement of a sub-theorem, does a proof always need to be given if 'obvious' or if obtained by inspection? Is there a way of saying "I got this by trying some numbers in a calculator and the pattern was clear"?

The motivations are brevity, clarity and keeping to the main point.

"By inspection, [...] is a solution" is always acceptable; the reader can easily check it, but it leaves open the possibility that there might be other solutions you didn't give.

"By induction we find that ..." is also acceptable, but don't bother giving the specific examples you looked at to deduce the general pattern. Again, the reader can easily check that the base case holds and verify the inductive step if it really is "obvious". Your reviewers will tell you if it isn't.
 
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  • #12
jbriggs444 said:
There is the old joke about the mathematics professor who goes to the blackboard writes down a few equations, and says "it is obvious that...". Then he pauses, scribbles furiously for twenty minutes and finally continues "yes, it is indeed obvious".
I read that Euler used to write "it is obvious that ..." for stuff that took him months of labour.
 

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