The Famous Romeo and Juliet Problem

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the "Romeo and Juliet problem" in differential equations, where participants explore a mathematical model representing the dynamics of love between two characters. The focus is on solving a pair of differential equations that describe the relationship, with varying levels of mathematical background among participants.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant presents the differential equations \(\frac{dR}{dt}=aJ\) and \(\frac{dJ}{dt}=-bR\) as a model for the relationship dynamics.
  • Another suggests differentiating and plugging in to find a solution.
  • A different viewpoint indicates that the problem can be treated as a second-order homogeneous equation.
  • One participant proposes using a vector approach, defining \(V(t)= \begin{pmatrix}R(t) \\ J(t)\end{pmatrix}\) and discussing the matrix representation of the system.
  • Another participant mentions the use of matrix exponentials to write the solution, questioning whether the original poster understands the modeling behind the equations.
  • One participant suggests looking up "linear differential equations" for similar examples, while another mentions the Laplace transform as a preferred method for finding solutions.
  • Concerns are raised about the complexity of eigenvalues and diagonalization for someone with only calculus II knowledge, indicating a potential mismatch in the level of mathematical sophistication required.
  • One participant expresses frustration about the academic sequence in their university, highlighting the challenges faced when advancing through courses without adequate preparation.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing opinions on the appropriate methods for solving the differential equations, with some advocating for simpler approaches and others suggesting more advanced techniques. There is no consensus on the best way to proceed, and the discussion remains unresolved regarding the most accessible solution method for the original poster.

Contextual Notes

Participants note the original poster's limited background in differential equations, which may affect their understanding of more advanced concepts like eigenvalues and diagonalization. The discussion reflects varying levels of mathematical knowledge and assumptions about the audience's familiarity with the subject matter.

Bipolarity
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I've been trying to solve the Romeo and Juliet problem in differential equations:

Romeo is in love with Juliet, but in our version of the story, Juliet
is a fickle lover. The more Romeo loves her, the more Juliet wants
to run away and hide. But when Romeo gets discouraged and
backs off, Juliet begins to find him strangely attractive. Romeo,
on the other hand, tends to echo her: he warms up when she loves
him, and grows cold when she hates him.

So let R = Romeo's love for Juliet and
let J = Juliet's love for Romeo

Then
\frac{dR}{dt}=aJ, \frac{dJ}{dt}=-bR

How might I solve this pair of differential equations? Is it possible? I have only taken calculus I and II by the way so my knowledge of DE is limited.

Thanks!

NOTE: This isn't for homework, just from a leisure book I'm reading. Some of you might know it!

BiP
 
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Easy, just differentiate then plug in.
 
Then it's second order homogenous, which are easy to solve.
 
Is that Strogatz btw?
 
Another way to do this is to treat it as a single "vector" problem. Let
V(t)= \begin{pmatrix}R(t) \\ J(t)\end{pmatrix}
then
\frac{dV}{dt}= \begin{pmatrix}\frac{dR}{dt} \\ \frac{dR}{dt}\end{pmatrix}= \begin{pmatrix}aJ(t) \\ bR(t)\end{pmatrix}
or
\frac{dV}{dt}= \begin{pmatrix}0 & a \\ b & 0\end{pmatrix}\begin{pmatrix}R(t) \\ J(t)\end{pmatrix}

That matrix has two distinct eigenvalues and so can be diagonalized.
 
You can also easily write the solution with the help of the matrix exponential. But I guess that is not what you want.

I always wonder when people start to apply differential equations as model for some situations, do they really understand why the differential equation describes the stated situation. In your example, do you understand why the equations are as they are to describe your Romeo/Julia love story?
 
Unstable said:
You can also easily write the solution with the help of the matrix exponential. But I guess that is not what you want.

I always wonder when people start to apply differential equations as model for some situations, do they really understand why the differential equation describes the stated situation. In your example, do you understand why the equations are as they are to describe your Romeo/Julia love story?

Yep! I just have trouble solving it.

BiP
 
I would recommend to google for "linear differential equations" and look for similar examples.
The net is full with scripts about this topic. Without knowledge in DEs it is nearly
impossible to find the solution in this case.

Alternatively, also the Laplace transfom (which I actually prefer) could be used
to calculate the solution.

My second standard question is always:

Could you solve

x'(t) = -k \cdot x(t) , \quad x(0)=x^0
 
HallsofIvy said:
Another way to do this is to treat it as a single "vector" problem. Let
V(t)= \begin{pmatrix}R(t) \\ J(t)\end{pmatrix}
then
\frac{dV}{dt}= \begin{pmatrix}\frac{dR}{dt} \\ \frac{dR}{dt}\end{pmatrix}= \begin{pmatrix}aJ(t) \\ bR(t)\end{pmatrix}
or
\frac{dV}{dt}= \begin{pmatrix}0 & a \\ b & 0\end{pmatrix}\begin{pmatrix}R(t) \\ J(t)\end{pmatrix}

That matrix has two distinct eigenvalues and so can be diagonalized.

Whoa there. He said he's taken up to calc 2, and you're talking eigenvalues and diagonalization to solve differential equations? There's no way he's going to understand that with just calc 2 knowledge.
 
  • #10
johnqwertyful said:
Whoa there. He said he's taken up to calc 2, and you're talking eigenvalues and diagonalization to solve differential equations? There's no way he's going to understand that with just calc 2 knowledge.

Ya that's what I said, but then the physics department at my university was all "meh meh meh, that's just how the sequence goes--take diffeqs and linear algebra next semester, after you've already taken waves and vibrations."

Struggling super hard.
 

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