Thermit Reaction: Electrical Energy from Al + Fe2O3

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the potential to generate electrical energy directly from the thermit reaction between aluminum and iron(III) oxide (Fe2O3). Participants explore the feasibility of using an electrolyte to facilitate this process, considering various chemical interactions and solubility issues.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions whether electrical energy can be generated directly from the thermit reaction instead of just heat and light, seeking advice on suitable electrolytes.
  • Another participant corrects the stoichiometry of the reaction, clarifying it as 2Al + Fe2O3 > 2Fe + Al2O3.
  • Some participants suggest that H2SO4 could be used to solvate Fe3+ ions, while noting that Fe2O3 is not water soluble.
  • Concerns are raised about the solubility of Fe2O3, with one participant referencing a source that states it is only soluble in HCl, which also reacts with aluminum.
  • There is a discussion about the activity series of metals, with one participant expressing uncertainty about aluminum's position and its implications for the reaction.
  • Participants propose using aluminum foil for initial tests due to its greater surface area, with plans to eventually use aluminum from cans and trailers.
  • One participant raises a potential issue with sulfuric acid reacting with aluminum oxide to form water, which could complicate the process.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express a range of views on the solubility of Fe2O3 and the suitability of different electrolytes, indicating that multiple competing perspectives exist without a clear consensus on the best approach.

Contextual Notes

There are unresolved questions regarding the solubility of Fe2O3 in various acids, the reactivity of aluminum with these acids, and the implications of using different aluminum sources for the reaction.

Uno Lee
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I was wondering if it would be possible to create electrical energy directly instead of heat and light in this exothermic reaction. Al + Fe2O3 = Fe + Al2O3 (Sorry "=" sign should be an arrow) What sort of electrolyte should be used?
 
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Oops, that's 2Al + Fe2O3 > 2Fe + Al2O3
 
Well Fe2O3 is not water soluble, so you would need something to solvate Fe3+ ions. I think H2SO4 would work. Stick an aluminum anode in aqueous solution of Fe2O3. For the cathode, you wouldn't necessarily need to use iron.
 
Thanks, I'll try this but by little book of solubilities says that Fe2O3 is only soluble in HCl and that (unfortunately) dissolves Al, too.
 
so-crates said:
Well Fe2O3 is not water soluble, so you would need something to solvate Fe3+ ions. I think H2SO4 would work. Stick an aluminum anode in aqueous solution of Fe2O3. For the cathode, you wouldn't necessarily need to use iron.
I want to stick to commonly found materials and keep it as non-toxic as possible. Aluminum is a commonly found material, that takes a lot of electricity to make. I'm looking for a way of getting that electricity back.
 
Uno Lee said:
Thanks, I'll try this but by little book of solubilities says that Fe2O3 is only soluble in HCl and that (unfortunately) dissolves Al, too.

It dissolves alumnium salts or does it react with alumimun metal? If the former, then it shouldn't be a problem. I forgot where alumimum was on the activity series for aqueous solutions but I believe it was below hydrogen so it shouldn't be a problem.

What were you planning on using for your alumnium block? Foil ?
 
Foil to test (greater surface area for reaction) then I want to try used pop and beer cans before moving up to aluminum campers and trailers.
 
Actually now that I think about you might run into a problem because the sulfic acid will react with oxide to form water.
 

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