Understanding Transitivity of a Set: An Example

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of transitive sets in set theory, exploring definitions, examples, and specific cases. Participants examine the properties of transitive sets and provide examples, while also addressing potential misunderstandings related to the transitivity of certain sets.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants define a transitive set as one where the elements of its elements are also elements of the set itself.
  • Examples of transitive sets provided include the set of natural numbers $\omega$ and individual natural numbers $n$.
  • One participant suggests the set of all rational numbers $\mathcal{Q}$ as a transitive set, arguing that integers are included within the rational numbers.
  • Another participant challenges the claim that $\mathcal{Q}$ is transitive, stating that integers are a subset of $\mathcal{Q}$ rather than elements of it.
  • There is a discussion about the repetition of the question across different platforms, indicating a search for clarity or confirmation.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on whether the set of rational numbers $\mathcal{Q}$ qualifies as a transitive set, indicating a lack of consensus on this example.

Contextual Notes

Some definitions and properties of transitive sets may depend on specific interpretations, and the discussion includes corrections and challenges to earlier claims without resolving the underlying questions.

Who May Find This Useful

Readers interested in set theory, particularly those studying transitive sets and their properties, may find this discussion relevant.

evinda
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Hi! (Smile)

According to my notes, a set $A$ is called transitive if the elements of its elements are elements of $A$.
For example, the set of natural numbers $\omega$ is a transitive set.

Also, if $n \in \omega$ then $n$ is a transitive set since $n=\{0,1,2, \dots, n-1 \}$ and if we take a $k \in n$ then $k=\{0,1,2, \dots, k-1 \}$.

Could you give me an example of an other transitive set? (Thinking)
 
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evinda said:
Hi! (Smile)

According to my notes, a set $A$ is called transitive if the elements of its elements are elements of $A$.

Yes. So a set $A$ is transitive if whenever $x\in A$ and $y\in x$ then $y\in A$.

evinda said:
For example, the set of natural numbers $\omega$ is a transitive set.

Also, if $n \in \omega$ then $n$ is a transitive set since $n=\{0,1,2, \dots, n-1 \}$ and if we take a $k \in n$ then $k=\{0,1,2, \dots, k-1 \}$.

Could you give me an example of an other transitive set? (Thinking)

Another example would be the set of all rational numbers $\mathcal{Q}$. If you take any subset of the rational numbers like the integers for example, for each $y\in\mathcal{Z}$ we have $y\in \mathcal{Q}$ since any integer is a rational number.
 
Sudharaka said:
Another example would be the set of all rational numbers $\mathcal{Q}$. If you take any subset of the rational numbers like the integers for example, for each $y\in\mathcal{Z}$ we have $y\in \mathcal{Q}$ since any integer is a rational number.
I don't think $\Bbb Q$ is transitive. In your explanation, $\Bbb Z\subseteq\Bbb Q$ and not $\Bbb Z\in\Bbb Q$.

Evinda, I see that you have asked this question on Math.StackExchange. Why are you asking it again?

P.S. "Another" is one word.
 
Evgeny.Makarov said:
Evinda, I see that you have asked this question on Math.StackExchange. Why are you asking it again?

I had asked it before here in mathhelpboards but I didn't get an answer and since I wanted to know the answer since I would write a test in Set theory the day after , I asked it also in Math.StackExchange...
 
Ah, I see that this is an old thread. I thought that you asked this question again recently.
 
Evgeny.Makarov said:
Ah, I see that this is an old thread. I thought that you asked this question again recently.

(Smile) I did well in the exams in Set theory.. Thanks for your help! (Happy)
 
Evgeny.Makarov said:
I don't think $\Bbb Q$ is transitive. In your explanation, $\Bbb Z\subseteq\Bbb Q$ and not $\Bbb Z\in\Bbb Q$.

Evinda, I see that you have asked this question on Math.StackExchange. Why are you asking it again?

P.S. "Another" is one word.

Yep. My mistake. That doesn't work. Thanks for pointing that out. :)
 

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