Universe is made of baryonic matter

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the composition of the universe, specifically focusing on the roles of baryonic matter, photons, dark matter, and dark energy. Participants explore the significance of photons in the context of the universe's density and expansion, addressing both early and present contributions of photons.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants note that while photons are quanta of the electromagnetic force, their contribution to the overall density of the universe is currently small and often neglected in calculations.
  • Others argue that the contribution of photons was significant in the early universe, particularly at high redshift, but question whether it remains negligible in the present universe.
  • A participant suggests that converting a fraction of baryonic mass into electromagnetic radiation would result in a large number of photons, implying their current contribution is negligible.
  • One participant introduces a cosmic calculator that includes the contribution of radiation in the early universe, indicating a resource for further exploration of this topic.
  • Another participant elaborates on the dynamics of the universe's expansion, discussing how the densities of radiation, matter, and vacuum energy evolve over time, and the implications for when radiation dominated the universe.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express uncertainty regarding the current significance of photons in the universe's density, with some suggesting they are negligible while others question this assumption. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the extent of photons' contributions in both the early and present universe.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference the time-dependent scale factor of the universe and the relationships between different components of the universe's energy density, indicating a complex interplay that is not fully settled in the discussion.

koolmodee
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So they say the universe is made of baryonic matter, dark matter and dark energy.

What about photons?
 
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Photons are the quanta of the EM force.
 


Photons do indeed contribute to the comoving density, its just that their contribution is currently quite small and can be neglected in most calculations. At high redshift, in the early universe, their contribution was non-negligible and you have to take them into account.
 


Thanks for the answers!

But I'm not quite satisfied yet. Was their contribution non-negligible only in the early universe? Is it present universe negligible?
 


Alright, when I think of it, converting only a tenth of the baryonic mass into electromagnetic radiation, that would add incredible many more photons to the universe, so I guess they are negligible.
 


koolmodee said:
Thanks for the answers!

But I'm not quite satisfied yet. Was their contribution non-negligible only in the early universe? Is it present universe negligible?

Let [itex]a ( t )[/itex] be the time-dependent scale factor of the universe. In an expanding universe, [itex]a ( t )[/itex] increases as [itex]t[/itex] increases. Assume that dark energy is vacuum energy, so that, in terms of energy/mass density, the three main components of the universe are radiation, matter, and vacuum energy.

As the universe expands, the densities of radiation and matter decrease. The density of matter is inversely proportional to [itex]a ( t )^3[/itex], one factor of [itex]a ( t )[/itex] for each dimension of space.

As the universe expands, the number density of photons is inversely proportional to the same factor, [itex]a ( t )^3[/itex]. The energy density of radiation includes an additional factor of [itex]a ( t )[/itex] because the wavelengths of radiation scale as [itex]a ( t )[/itex] (wavelengths expand along with the universe), and energy of radiation is inversely proportional to wavelength, so that the density of radiation is inversely proportional to [itex]a ( t )^4[/itex].

Since the expansion of space is, roughly, the addition of more of the same vacuum, the vacuum energy density is constant in time.

Comparing the time-evolution properties of the three components shows that there is a time [itex]t_1[/itex] before which radiation dominated, and a time [itex]t_2 > t_1[/itex] after which the vacuum dominates. Relative values of the densities for our universe are such that between [itex]t_1[/itex] and [itex]t_2[/itex] matter dominates.
 


thanks! I remember I read something like that in Barbara Ryden cosmology book, but forgot it all. many thanks
 

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