What happens to uncertainty when I divide values by a constant and squ

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the propagation of uncertainty in measurements related to wire thickness, specifically when calculating the radius and cross-sectional area of wires. The original poster presents a scenario involving measurements taken with a micrometer screw gauge, noting a specific uncertainty associated with those measurements.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Assumption checking, Mathematical reasoning

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants explore how uncertainty changes when values are halved and when squared. There are discussions about the mathematical principles behind uncertainty propagation, including absolute and relative errors.

Discussion Status

Some participants provide insights into the mathematical relationships governing uncertainty, while others question the accuracy of certain assertions regarding how uncertainty behaves under squaring and division. Multiple interpretations of the effects on uncertainty are being explored.

Contextual Notes

The original poster's inquiry is framed within the context of a physics investigation, and there are references to specific measurement uncertainties and their implications for calculations involving area.

Akbar123
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The values below are different wire thicknesses measured with a micrometer screw gauge. The uncertainty of it is +/- 0.01mm.

Diameter/thickness of wire/mm
0.02
0.10
0.14
0.30
0.42

I need to halve (or divide by two) these values to calculate radius and hence calculate cross sectional area of the wires. What happens to the uncertainty of +/- 0.01mm.

In addition what happens to the uncertainty of the radius when I square these values using the equation area of circle = πr2 ?

This is for a physics investigation.
 
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You calculate cross section with ## a = {\pi\over 4} d^2##.
Propagation of independent uncertainties works as follows:
$$\bigl ( \Delta f(x_1, x_2, x_3 ... x_N) \bigr )^2 = \Sigma_{i=1}^N \ ({\partial f \over \partial x_i})^2 (\Delta x_i)^2$$
Examples:
##f = a\,x \quad \Rightarrow \quad \Delta f = |a|\,\Delta x \quad ## or: ## \quad {\Delta f \over f} = |a|\,{\Delta x\over x} ##
##f = x_1 + x_2 \quad \Rightarrow \quad (\Delta f)^2 = (\Delta x_1)^2 + (\Delta x_2)^2##
##f = x_1 \times x_2 \quad \Rightarrow \quad (\Delta f)^2 = x_2^2 (\Delta x_1)^2 + x_1^2(\Delta x_2)^2 \quad \Rightarrow \quad ({\Delta f\over f})^2 = ({\Delta x_1 \over x_1})^2 + ({\Delta x_2 \over x_2})^2 ##
but ##f = x_1^2 \quad \Rightarrow \quad (\Delta f)^2 = 4 x_1^2 (\Delta x_1)^2 \quad \Rightarrow \quad ({\Delta f\over f}) = 2 ({\Delta x_1 \over x_1}) ##

In short:
addition and subtraction: add absolute errors quadratically
multiplication and division: add relative errors quadratically
squares: double relative error, square root: halve relative error

In your case ##{\Delta a \over a }= 2 {\Delta d \over d}##
 
You would also divide the uncertainty (or error) by 2. If you make the measurement smaller, you also make the associated uncertainty with that measurement smaller, in this case x2 smaller. Squaring the r value will result in the uncertainty being doubled. So your ## r^2 ## will actually just be +/- 0.01 mm uncertainty. If it was the diameter squared, the uncertainty would be doubled, so +/- 0.02 mm .
 
patrickmoloney said:
Squaring the r value will result in the uncertainty being doubled
Demonstrably incorrect: ##(10 \pm 1)^2 = 100 \pm 20 \quad ##(*) and not ## 100 \pm 2##

What he means is that the relative error is doubled.

(*) here you see the effect of taking only the first derivative and ignoring the higher orders. It's a small effect, given that this shows up marginally (namely 1%) even at a 10% relative error.
 

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