What is the origin of the phrase 'cannot be overstated'?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Hornbein
  • Start date Start date
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the origin and usage of the phrase "cannot be overstated." Participants explore its historical context, potential misuses, and related expressions in other languages. The scope includes linguistic analysis and cultural observations.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Meta-discussion

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests that the phrase "cannot be overstated" originated with the 2012 film "The Hunger Games," while another counters that examples exist from the 19th century.
  • Some participants mention the Oxford English Dictionary (OED) as a resource for tracing the first use of the phrase, with one noting a potential first use in 1792.
  • There is a discussion about the phrase "the importance of this cannot be understated," with a participant proposing that it may stem from a confusion between "cannot" and "should not."
  • Another participant introduces similar phrases in other languages, such as Polish and Russian, and discusses the challenges bilingual speakers face with such expressions.
  • Several participants share anecdotes about the compact version of the OED and its physical challenges, including the need for a magnifying glass to read it.
  • There is a humorous exchange about the nostalgia for encyclopedias and the role of encyclopedia salesmen in the past.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the origin of the phrase "cannot be overstated," with some asserting it is a recent addition to the language while others provide evidence of its earlier usage. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the exact origin and correct usage of related phrases.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference the OED for historical usage, but there are limitations in accessing the full resource. The discussion also highlights the potential for misunderstanding phrases across languages, indicating a need for careful consideration of linguistic nuances.

Hornbein
Gold Member
Messages
3,874
Reaction score
3,115
Such-and-such "cannot be overstated." I see this figure of speech often. It wasn't around in the 20th century. Where did it come from?

I suggest it appeared in 2012 with first "The Hunger Games" film where a TV emcee says this.

I also often see it gotten wrong, as in "the importance of this cannot be understated."
 
  • Skeptical
Likes   Reactions: BillTre
Science news on Phys.org
Hornbein said:
It wasn't around in the 20th century.
Google books has examples going back to the 19th century.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: BillTre, russ_watters, Vanadium 50 and 2 others
If you can get your hands on the OED - the full multivolume one - it will have a first use.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: pinball1970, BillTre and Astronuc
As to "the importance of this cannot be understated." goes, this could well be due to someone using "cannot" in place of "should not" . For example, people often say something like, "We cannot let this happen." rather than, "We should not let this happen", since "cannot" appears to carry more weight.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: Vanadium 50, dextercioby, BillTre and 1 other person
Could be interesting to check how similar phrases work in other languages, especially those used by minorities in English speaking countries.

Polish is far from being able to influence English, but we have a similar phrase ("nie da się przecenić" - smth like "can't be priced too high"), and I know from experience bilingual people tend to mangle such things (especially when there is some kind of gradation involved and when the intended meaning is different from the verbatim meaning).
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: pinball1970 and dextercioby
Borek said:
Could be interesting to check how similar phrases work in other languages, especially those used by minorities in English speaking countries.

Polish is far from being able to influence English, but we have a similar phrase ("nie da się przecenić" - smth like "can't be priced too high"), and I know from experience bilingual people tend to mangle such things (especially when there is some kind of gradation involved and when the intended meaning is different from the verbatim meaning).
Yeah the students we supervised as ESL were really interested in slang and phrases that had their mother tongue equivalent.
"Stag do," was one.
 
Borek said:
"nie da się przecenić" - smth like "can't be priced too high"
"Нельзя переоценить" ~ "nel'zia pereotcenit'" - "cannot be overvalued", in Russian.
 
  • Informative
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: Borek and pinball1970
Vanadium 50 said:
If you can get your hands on the OED - the full multivolume one - it will have a first use.

I thought "Oh cool, I've got that, I'll go look it up!" Well it turns out we have the "compact" OED. It's two volumes that are each about 15lbs. It hurts to lift one of them and you kind of need a magnifying glass to read the text on the tissue-thin pages. That's the compact version.

I looked at oed.com and they listed the oldest known use of the phrase in 1792: (link)
 
They used to - and maybe still do - sell the compact one with a magnifying glass.

I learned about this when I reached out to them correcting a first use. I was kind of hoping they would give me an OED as a token of thanks, nut no such luck.
 
  • #10
Vanadium 50 said:
They used to - and maybe still do - sell the compact one with a magnifying glass.

I learned about this when I reached out to them correcting a first use. I was kind of hoping they would give me an OED as a token of thanks, nut no such luck.

Yeah, it's got a little drawer on top of the case with a big magnifying glass in it. I don't how old the set is but it was probably from the 1980s. I kind of overestimated the weight though. The second volume weighed in at 8.4lbs.

Too bad they didn't gift you a set. I imagine you can get all of this information online now although maybe not for free. I kind of miss the old stuff, awkward as it was. As a tiny tot I learned how to add and subtract by using the volume numbers printed on the spines of our Funk & Wagnalls encyclopedia as a guide.

There used to be encyclopedia salesmen, imagine that!
 
  • #11
JT Smith said:
There used to be encyclopedia salesmen, imagine that!
I remember encyclopedias. I was giving a colloquium somewhere or other, and I found a racy, spicy, book in my hotel room entitled "Girl to Grab". Imagine my disappointment when I found out it was Volume 7 of the encyclopedia. <rimshot>
 
  • Haha
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: berkeman and BillTre

Similar threads

  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
3K
  • Sticky
  • · Replies 0 ·
Replies
0
Views
4K
  • · Replies 188 ·
7
Replies
188
Views
30K
  • · Replies 87 ·
3
Replies
87
Views
10K
Replies
14
Views
5K
Replies
6
Views
4K
  • · Replies 79 ·
3
Replies
79
Views
12K
  • · Replies 17 ·
Replies
17
Views
4K
Replies
90
Views
11K
  • · Replies 29 ·
Replies
29
Views
4K