What's the Point of High-Powered Cars in a World of Speed Limits?

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The discussion centers on the relevance of high-powered cars, particularly those with V10 engines capable of speeds exceeding 200 mph, in a world where speed limits are often capped at 70 mph. Participants argue that the existence of such vehicles contributes to societal issues like speeding-related accidents and fuel costs. The conversation highlights the role of consumer demand in shaping automotive production, suggesting that manufacturers prioritize desires over practical speed regulations. Additionally, the debate touches on the effectiveness of speed limiters and the responsibilities of governments in regulating vehicle capabilities.

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wolram
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AFAIK the only country one can go above 70mph is Germany, so why are these huge engined cars sold world wide, what is the use owning a car with a v10 engine capable of 200mph when your local motorway has a 70mph top limit.
In fact some 1600cc cars can go over 120mph, it is just crazy when every one is complaining of fuel costs, the most sensible thing would be to design a car with a max of 100mph you can have all the bells and whistles on it you want, so long as can pull a caravan:rolleyes:
 
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wolram said:
AFAIK the only country one can go above 70mph is Germany, so why are these huge engined cars sold world wide, what is the use owning a car with a v10 engine capable of 200mph when your local motorway has a 70mph top limit.
In fact some 1600cc cars can go over 120mph, it is just crazy when every one is complaining of fuel costs, the most sensible thing would be to design a car with a max of 100mph you can have all the bells and whistles on it you want, so long as can pull a caravan:rolleyes:

I don't understand it either.
The social and economic costs of speeding are huge and governments spend millions on ad campaigns trying to scare drivers into staying within the speed limit.
Speeding is the second greatest cause of traffic incidents, behind distraction and ahead of alcohol, and the (partial) solution seems bleedingly obvious - speed limiters.
Of the cars that do have speed limiters the lowest I've heard of is 180 km/hr, many german cars are 250 km/hr.
There are so many safety regulations piled on production cars manufacturers but limiters never get a mention? Perplexing.
 
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Well, for starters because large manufacturers are not in the business of deciding for us what we need.
It is the consumers that drive what the manufacturers produce.
And consumers don't have to justify their desires.

This is an argument my wife puts forth a lot 'Why would anyone need X? Why don't we only make Y?'
To which my response is (diplomatically) 'Not your call'.
 
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Look at this list, one has to go back to a 1973 mk 3 triumph to find a reasonable spec car, sure safety has improved and production costs have come down so we should be able to make a mk3 triumph variant cheaply and safe.
http://www.autosnout.com/Car-Top-Speed-List.php
 
By whose definition of 'reasonable'? And who said 'reasonable' is the only allowed goal?

If you want a reasonable car, get a Corolla.
Are you deciding what other people should get to want? or am I missing the point of this thread?
 
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DaveC426913 said:
Well, for starters because large manufacturers are not in the business of deciding for us what we need.
It is the consumers that drive what the manufacturers produce.
And consumers don't have to justify their desires.

This is an argument my wife puts forth a lot 'Why would anyone need X? Why don't we only make Y?'
To which my response is (diplomatically) 'Not your call'.

It should be down to governments,god help us, to make sane judgments on car manufacturers they make up the speed limits.
 
wolram said:
It should be down to governments,god help us, to make sane judgments on car manufacturers they make up the speed limits.
It's not up to the government to decide what we want.

I think you will find that high speed is not the greatest cause of preventable accidents, so limiting it in cars is not an effective strategy for saving lives and property.
 
DaveC426913 said:
By whose definition of 'reasonable'? And who said 'reasonable' is the only allowed goal?

If you want a reasonable car, get a Corolla.
Are you deciding what other people should get to want? or am I missing the point of this thread?

Look at my list Dave then decide is you want one of the top 30,40 cars(why would you) unless you want to be able to break the law in first gear
 
What's your point? It's a free country. Who gets to decide what people are allowed to want?

Less argumentatively: what problem are you hoping you solve?
 
  • #10
DaveC426913 said:
It's not up to the government to decide what we want.

I think you will find that high speed is not the greatest cause of preventable accidents, so limiting it in cars is not an effective strategy for saving lives and property.

http://think.direct.gov.uk/speed.html the government think differently.
 
  • #11
wolram said:
AFAIK the only country one can go above 70mph is Germany, so why are these huge engined cars sold world wide, what is the use owning a car with a v10 engine capable of 200mph when your local motorway has a 70mph top limit.

This statement is not true. There are a number of countries around the globe where speeds of 70 mph and above are legal. In some of these countries, you don't want to drive less than 70, if you value your life.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speed_limits_by_country

In fact some 1600cc cars can go over 120mph, it is just crazy when every one is complaining of fuel costs, the most sensible thing would be to design a car with a max of 100mph you can have all the bells and whistles on it you want, so long as can pull a caravan:rolleyes:

Why 100 mph? If you can't drive legally at 100 mph, why should your car be able to go that fast? Why not 35 mph, if fuel costs are the determining factor?

Why do trains get to go 180 mph? Because they run on track? What about derailments?

Same with planes. Why should planes fly 500 mph? Why not 100 mph? There are planes which are perfectly capable of flying at 100 mph.

If you drive over 100 mph and then complain about fuel cost, don't drive that fast.
 
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  • #12
wolram said:
http://think.direct.gov.uk/speed.html the government think differently.
Considering their benchmark is 30mph, I don't know how it applies to fast cars going fast. It applies to lead feet on urban streets. Even a VW can do 30.
 
  • #13
DaveC426913 said:
What's your point? It's a free country. Who gets to decide what people are allowed to want?

Less argumentatively: what problem are you hoping you solve?

It is not a free country, one can not do as one wants, if governments are elected to support speed limits they should not allow cars that can break it in first gear.
 
  • #14
wolram said:
It is not a free country, one can not do as one wants, if governments are elected to support speed limits they should not allow cars that can break it in first gear.
Well, the difference between capitalism and fascism is how much the government gets to decide what's best for everyone.
 
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  • #16
DaveC426913 said:
Well, the difference between capitalism and fascism is how much the government gets to decide what's best for everyone.
This is the one time that Volkswagen should win, the peoples car in fact, you can tart it up give it other specs but keep the top speed below 100mph.
 
  • #17
wolram said:
It is not a free country, one can not do as one wants, if governments are elected to support speed limits they should not allow cars that can break it in first gear.
Fortunately, you are wrong. This IS a free country, more or less, and If you don't like it, you should go live in a country where the government gets to decide such thing. There are some.

Why are you so intent on imposing your morality on other people? It won't work, you know. People will decide what they want, and I'll bet none of them consult you, and manufacturers will build what they want.

You are making a logical argument that is divorced from the reality of the world we live in.
 
  • #18
phinds said:
Fortunately, you are wrong. This IS a free country, more or less, and If you don't like it, you should go live in a country where the government gets to decide such thing. There are some.

Why are you so intent on imposing your morality on other people? It won't work, you know. People will decide what they want, and I'll bet none of them consult you, and manufacturers will build what they want.

You are making a logical argument that is divorced from the reality of the world we live in.
You are wrong, this is not a free country, we have laws, where the hell is the sense in allowing cars on our roads that can break the speed limit 3 times over
 
  • #19
wolram said:
You are wrong, this is not a free country, we have laws, where the hell is the sense in allowing cars on our roads that can break the speed limit 3 times over
Again, you are making a logical argument that is pointless. I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm saying it doesn't matter. People are going to do what THEY want to do, not what you want them to do.
 
  • #20
phinds said:
Again, you are making a logical argument that is pointless. I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm saying it doesn't matter. People are going to do what THEY want to do, not what you want them to do.

And they are going to keep on killing innocent people. if you look at my other post SPEED KILLS it is official.
 
  • #21
wolram said:
And they are going to keep on killing innocent people. if you look at my other post SPEED KILLS it is official.
As I said, I'm not arguing with your point, I'm just saying it is divorced from the reality we live in.

Popcorn has little to no nutritional value and when slathered with salt and butter, it's definitely bad for you. I eat it every now and then. By your logic, the government should ban popcorn. It's not going to happen.

You are doing what in the military is called "pissing up a rope". You'll get yourself wet and have zero effect on the rest of the world.
 
  • #22
wolram said:
what is the use owning a car with a v10 engine capable of 200mph when your local motorway has a 70mph top limit.
In fact some 1600cc cars can go over 120mph, it is just crazy when every one is complaining of fuel costs, the most sensible thing would be to design a car with a max of 100mph
It's my understanding that one of the reasons cars can go much faster than the streets they drive is for engine longevity. A car moving at half its capability will wear down less than a car moving at near max capability.
 
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  • #23
Greg Bernhardt said:
It's my understanding that one of the reasons cars can go much faster than the streets they drive is for engine longevity. A car moving at half its capability will wear down less than a car moving at near max capability.

So some of the super cars will have to drive at well in excess of 200mph to save there engines:eek:
 
  • #24
wolram said:
So some of the super cars will have to drive at well in excess of 200mph to save there engines:eek:
The super cars are often driven at very fast speeds on tracks
 
  • #25
phinds said:
As I said, I'm not arguing with your point, I'm just saying it is divorced from the reality we live in.

Popcorn has little to no nutritional value and when slathered with salt and butter, it's definitely bad for you. I eat it every now and then. By your logic, the government should ban popcorn. It's not going to happen.

You are doing what in the military is called "pissing up a rope". You'll get yourself wet and have zero effect on the rest of the world.

I may well be pissing up a rope but any sane person would agree there should be a( safe) speed to drive. and for any government to allow car manufacturers to build and sell car that can break this limit may just as well be in the military selling guns.
 
  • #26
Greg Bernhardt said:
The super cars are often driven at very fast speeds on tracks

Fair enough, they can and do kill them self's on tracks even
 
  • #27
wolram said:
AFAIK the only country one can go above 70mph is Germany, so why are these huge engined cars sold world wide, what is the use owning a car with a v10 engine capable of 200mph when your local motorway has a 70mph top limit.

Because, top trumps.

plus V10s sound amazing.
 
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  • #28
DaveC426913 said:
Well, for starters because large manufacturers are not in the business of deciding for us what we need.
They already have and still do. My first car, a 1983 Mitsubishi Cordia turbo, like nearly all japanese cars, was limited to 180km/hr. This was not due to consumer demand.

DaveC426913 said:
It's not up to the government to decide what we want.

Many governments (Japan, Korea, EU) have put pedestrian safety legislation in place, if car designs don't meet the spec. they can't be sold. (I recall cars failing due to poor bumper design but google is not forthcoming with a link)
I assume it's the same for many other now ubiquitous safety features - seat belts, airbags, crumple zones etc

I think you will find that high speed is not the greatest cause of preventable accidents, so limiting it in cars is not an effective strategy for saving lives and property.

By that reasoning we should give up attempting to reduce obesity because it's not the greatest cause of preventable deaths..

SteamKing said:
Why do trains get to go 180 mph?

Because experts have deemed it is a safe speed for the given system?
Are trains capable of going over double their max posted speed limit? I wouldn't think so, it would be a total waste of resources, no one would buy a train that over engineered.
It's not a great analogy as the owner and driver are not the same person unlike most cars, but the point stands, why do we produce cars capable of over double the speed that the system is intended for?

Who here has driven their car at it's max speed? Driving safely at 200km/hr requires skill well beyond any normal driver licensing process provides and most roads are not designed for it.
 
  • #29
billy_joule said:
By that reasoning we should give up attempting to reduce obesity because it's not the greatest cause of preventable deaths..
Bad analogy. Obesity is not a market-driven feature.

I'm not saying there's no point in reducing accidents at high speeds, I'm saying, if Wolram wants to save lots of lives, he's being penny-wise but pound-foolish.
 
  • #30
wolram said:
Look at this list, one has to go back to a 1973 mk 3 triumph to find a reasonable spec car, sure safety has improved and production costs have come down so we should be able to make a mk3 triumph variant cheaply and safe.
http://www.autosnout.com/Car-Top-Speed-List.php

http://www.parkers.co.uk/cars/reviews/facts-and-figures/dacia/sandero/hatchback-2013/58120/

There you go old boy. Safe in the knowledge that it'd only do 100mph if you drove it off a cliff.
Cheap as chips too.

Now I'll have the M5 thanks.
 

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