Why Are U-B and B-V Values Important in Studying Stars and Clusters?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the significance of U-B and B-V values in the study of stars and star clusters, focusing on their implications for understanding stellar brightness and color. Participants explore the meanings of these values, their relationships, and their relevance in astrophysical contexts.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants explain that U, B, and V represent a star's brightness in the ultraviolet, blue, and visible ranges, respectively, with lower values indicating higher light output.
  • It is noted that a low or negative U-B value suggests a star is bright in the ultraviolet compared to blue, while a high B-V value indicates low blue light output, potentially making the star appear reddish.
  • One participant observes a correlation between U-B and B-V values, suggesting that very red stars have large positive values for both, while very blue stars have small negative values.
  • There is a question about whether to compare U-B or B-V values, or both, when ordering stars by color from red to blue.
  • Some participants mention that the interpretation of these values can be complicated by factors such as dust and starbursts in galaxies, which may reverse expected color relationships.
  • A participant expresses confusion about the importance of U-B and B-V values if they are not fixed, questioning their relevance in the study of stars and clusters.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express varying levels of understanding and interpretation regarding the significance and application of U-B and B-V values. There is no consensus on the implications of these values or their fixed nature, indicating ongoing debate and exploration.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight that the relationships between U-B and B-V values may not be straightforward due to external factors affecting stellar colors, suggesting limitations in their application.

randa177
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How can I get a sense of the numbers of (U-B) and (B-V)...
if a value of U-B for a star is larger than the other what does it mean? What about B-V... and what about the negative values...
 
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U, B, and V represent a star's brightness in the ultraviolet, blue, and visible ranges, respectively. Here, brightness is measured on a logarithmic scale where lower values mean higher light output. So if U-B is low or negative, that means the star is bright in the ultraviolet compared to blue. If B-V is high, that means the star is outputting very little light in blue, so the star is likely to look reddish.

For some typical values, try looking up some famous stars on Wikipedia and looking at the sidebar. Here are some nice examples:

Betelgeuse (very red)
Rigel (very blue)
Altair, Vega (somewhere in between)
 
ideasrule said:
U, B, and V represent a star's brightness in the ultraviolet, blue, and visible ranges, respectively. Here, brightness is measured on a logarithmic scale where lower values mean higher light output. So if U-B is low or negative, that means the star is bright in the ultraviolet compared to blue. If B-V is high, that means the star is outputting very little light in blue, so the star is likely to look reddish.

For some typical values, try looking up some famous stars on Wikipedia and looking at the sidebar. Here are some nice examples:

Betelgeuse (very red)
Rigel (very blue)
Altair, Vega (somewhere in between)

By looking at the values of the U-B and B-V that you suggested it seems that there is a corelation between U-B and B-V... for a really red star both values are large and positive, for a very blue star both values are small and negative, and for stars in between theu have smaal positive number... is this a general rule?
So If for example I want to order a set of colors from the most red to the most blue, do I compare the U-B or the B-V or balance them both?
 
These are 'colors' over some specified range. For stars, it mostly means that the value of any of these combinations is very high or low, it will be so for about every combination (within the convention that in X-Y A is a bluer band than Y).

This is not necessarily true though, and the colors of galaxies do reverse sometimes, due to dust, starbursts and so on. If you look at 'color color selection criteria' for galaxies you will find some plots where galaxies are 'high' (we call it blue) in some color, but 'low' (i.e. red) in another.
 
harcel said:
These are 'colors' over some specified range. For stars, it mostly means that the value of any of these combinations is very high or low, it will be so for about every combination (within the convention that in X-Y A is a bluer band than Y).

This is not necessarily true though, and the colors of galaxies do reverse sometimes, due to dust, starbursts and so on. If you look at 'color color selection criteria' for galaxies you will find some plots where galaxies are 'high' (we call it blue) in some color, but 'low' (i.e. red) in another.

I am not sure I understand what you mean, so if these values of U-B and B-V are not fixed then why are they so important in the study of stars and clusters... etc?
 

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