Why can't this process run forever?

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The discussion centers on the confusion surrounding a cyclic process described within an isolated box, where heat flows into the system from its surroundings. Participants express uncertainty about the specifics of the cycle, questioning the nature of the box and whether it truly has adiabatic walls. There is a consensus that the problem statement is vague and lacks essential details needed for a thorough analysis. The importance of clarifying the system's description and understanding the principles of cyclic systems and entropy is emphasized. Overall, the complexity of the question and the need for clearer communication are highlighted as barriers to finding a solution.
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A cyclic cycle occurring in a system immersed in surrounding, all inside an isolated box. Each cycle, net heat flow into the system from isolated surroundings in the box and the box has an inlet which just enough heat flows to balance that consumed by the cycle. why can't this process run forever?

attempt:

I know that Q=-W in this case. But I don't know how to explain.
 
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The situation is incompletely described:

get_physical said:
A cyclic cycle
... is there any other kind?
What sort of cycle? What causes the cycle?

... occurring in a system immersed in surrounding,
... "in surrounding" what?

... all inside an isolated box.
The box is all by itself? Or do you mean an isolating box? i.e. a box with adiabatic walls?

Each cycle, net heat flow into the system from isolated surroundings in the box and the box has an inlet which just enough heat flows to balance that consumed by the cycle. why can't this process run forever?
Heat can flow from outside the box - so not adiabatic walls - so the box is not isolating??
How can heat energy get "consumed" by the cycle? (i.e. what does that mean?)

The place to start with this is to be more careful about describing the system under study.
Be pedantic about it.
 
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Simon Bridge said:
The situation is incompletely described:

... is there any other kind?
What sort of cycle? What causes the cycle?

... "in surrounding" what?

The box is all by itself? Or do you mean an isolating box? i.e. a box with adiabatic walls?

Heat can flow from outside the box - so not adiabatic walls - so the box is not isolating??
How can heat energy get "consumed" by the cycle? (i.e. what does that mean?)

The place to start with this is to be more careful about describing the system under study.
Be pedantic about it.

I'm just as confused as you are. That's how the question was given to me by my teacher...
 
Simon Bridge said:
The situation is incompletely described:

... is there any other kind?
What sort of cycle? What causes the cycle?

... "in surrounding" what?

The box is all by itself? Or do you mean an isolating box? i.e. a box with adiabatic walls?

Heat can flow from outside the box - so not adiabatic walls - so the box is not isolating??
How can heat energy get "consumed" by the cycle? (i.e. what does that mean?)

The place to start with this is to be more careful about describing the system under study.
Be pedantic about it.

The question just says "consider a cyclic change occurring in a system that is immersed in surroundings, all inside an isolated box.
 
I think you'd better post the question verbatim - i.e. copy it out word for word.
Mind you - you won't always be given everything you need to know as part of the problem statement: some of it will be in the course notes and/or delivered in class.

But if it is really that vaguely worded, I don't think we can help you much - have you tried discussing it with your classmates? If everyone has the same problem then you can confront the teacher as a group.

Anyway there are still some things you can figure out, like:
What do you know about cyclic systems? (review course notes: have you covered heat engines?)
Consider how entropy factors into this?
 
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