Why Do Partial Derivatives and Full Differentiability Differ for f(x,y)?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the evaluation of the function f(x,y) = (2xy)/(x² + y²) at the point (0,0) and the differences between partial derivatives and full differentiability in the context of multivariable calculus. Participants explore the implications of using different definitions of derivatives and the behavior of the function near the origin.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant evaluates the function at (0,0) and finds a discrepancy between the partial derivative and the full derivative, leading to confusion about the results.
  • Another participant questions the definition of the derivative being used and asserts that the function cannot be continuously extended at the origin.
  • A participant clarifies that the limit for the derivative should be calculated using the Newton quotient and provides a detailed explanation of the limits involved.
  • One participant argues that the partial derivatives at (0,0) yield a limit of 0, while the full derivative (or gradient) requires a different limit that does not exist as (x,y) approaches (0,0).
  • There is a suggestion that the distinction between having partial derivatives and being differentiable is crucial for functions of multiple variables, indicating that continuity of partial derivatives at a point is necessary for differentiability.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the evaluation of the function at (0,0) and the relationship between partial derivatives and differentiability. No consensus is reached regarding the implications of the findings or the correct interpretation of the derivatives.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include the dependence on definitions of derivatives and the specific behavior of the function near the origin, which remains unresolved.

naggy
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f(x,y) = (2xy)/(x2 + y2), 0 if (x,y) = (0,0)

Now I'm supposed to evaluate this at (0,0). I take the first partial derivative and I get 0/0 but when I use the definition of derivatives I get a whole number. Why the hell is this?
 
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What "definition" of the derivatives?

That function cannot be given a continuous extension at the origion.
 
I'm sorry. I'm talking about the definition of derivative, the Newton quotient. Letting the limit go to zero.

lim (f(x+h,y) - f(x,y))/h
(x,y) -> (0,0)
 
naggy said:
f(x,y) = (2xy)/(x2 + y2), 0 if (x,y) = (0,0)
Now I'm supposed to evaluate this at (0,0). I take the first partial derivative and I get 0/0 but when I use the definition of derivatives I get a whole number. Why the hell is this?
Surely you do not mean "I'm supposed to evaluate this at (0,0)". That's easy: it's 0!

As for the derivatives, I'm afraid I get exactly the opposite result to you.
The derivative with respect to x is taken for y fixed so it is the limit of [f(0+h,0)- f(0,0)]/h= 0. The derivative with respect to y is the same. (If you just "plug in" h=0 you get 0/0 but you know from Calculus I that that happens for any derivative.) The derivative is 0 because f(h,0)= 0 for any h. 0/h= 0 which has limit 0 as h goes to 0. Of course, the same is true the partial derivative with respect to y.

In order that the "derivative" (really the "gradient"), as opposed to the partial derivatives, the limit of [itex][f(x+h_1,y+h_2)- f(x,y)]/\sqrt{h_1^2+ h_2^2}[/itex] must exist as [itex]h_1[/itex] and [itex]h_2[/itex] go to 0 independently. Since we are talking about (x,y)= (0,0) this is just the same as taking the limit of
[tex]\frac{2xy}{(x^2+ y^2)^{3/2}}[/tex]
as (x, y) goes to (0, 0). (I've replaced [itex]h_1[/itex] and [itex]h_2[/itex] by x and y for convenience.)
Best way to find a limit like that is to convert to polar coordinates:
[tex]\frac{2(r cos(\theta))(r sin(\theta))}{r^3}= \frac{2 sin(\theta)cos(\theta)}{r}[/tex]
which clearly does not exist as r goes to 0.

Why the hell is this?
I suspect that your textbook is trying to convince you that "having partial derivatives" and "being differentiable" are not the same for functions of more than one variable. A function of several variables is "differentiable" at a point if and only if its partial derivatives are continuous at that point.
 

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