Why No Boeing 737Max Prosecutions For Criminal Negligence?

[morrobay]

Boeing didn't knowingly implement and then hide a major, known to be faulty system, they implemented a system that should have been insignificant and turned out to be significant because of an unknown flaw. It's negligent engineering/management, but not criminally negligent because they didn't purposely create, much less hide the flaw. Unless something changes about what we know, there is virtually no chance of criminal prosecution coming from this.

Please, please tell me that you've learned something from this thread and tell me what elements the texting and driving example in the article you linked has that the 737 case does not, and therefore why texting and driving warrants jail time and the 737 case does not.

I chose all the links for the sufficiently complex 737max reports only. Unfortunetly some beside the point very simple auto cases were included. But since you have asked: I would have to say that there is negligence in both cases and they both warrent jailtime. Regarding the "unknown" flaw that you claim Boeing did not purposely hide, see the link here that specifically is counter to that claim.
https://www.npr.org/2019/05/06/7205...ensor-problem-before-plane-crash-in-indonesia

 

[Rubidium_71]

The message of Fight Club was that corporations are soulless and evil and terrorism(!) is therefore justified in order to even the score. Really?

The quote I referenced was simply a comment on the corporate quality control process I thought might be relevant. I at no time endorsed the overall message of the book or film and certainly made no reference at all to terrorism(!).

 

[gleem]

The NY Times has reported internal communications that indicated that the Boeing employees where dissing the FAA and that issues with the 737 MAX were well known.

Boeing has responded with “We regret the content of these communications, and apologize to the F.A.A., Congress, our airline customers and to the flying public for them.”

Some quotes from these communications:“Would you put your family on a Max simulator trained aircraft? I wouldn’t,” Prior to the two crashes

"This airplane is designed by clowns, who are in turn supervised by monkeys.” 2017

What moral responsibility do these people bear in not actively trying to bring the problems to the attention of the FAA?

 

[Rubidium_71]

issues with the 737 MAX were well known.

I think that's what really bothers most of the posters here. Safety issues should be disclosed as soon as they are discovered. I don't expect my car to be built like a tank, but if GM knows there's a problem I expect them to notify me rather than keeping it to themselves.

 

[russ_watters]

The NY Times has reported internal communications that indicated that the Boeing employees where dissing the FAA and that issues with the 737 MAX were well known.

Boeing has responded with “We regret the content of these communications, and apologize to the F.A.A., Congress, our airline customers and to the flying public for them.”

Some quotes from these communications:“Would you put your family on a Max simulator trained aircraft? I wouldn’t,” Prior to the two crashes

"This airplane is designed by clowns, who are in turn supervised by monkeys.” 2017

What moral responsibility do these people bear in not actively trying to bring the problems to the attention of the FAA?

That depends on what problems they were referring to. I read several articles and found little or no context for those quotes.

I have seen nothing so far that says anyone was aware of the bug in the MCAS software.

 

[gleem]

The latest from Aviation Week says that Boeing dissuaded Lion Air of requiring simulator training on the MAX from the very beginning citing unnecessary expense to the airline.

The documents, comprising external and internal emails and internal instant message exchanges, underscore the priority Boeing placed on positioning the MAX as nearly the same as its predecessor, the 737 Next Generation (NG). They also offer some of the most compelling evidence yet that Boeing consciously chose less costly approaches over safer, more conservative ones during the MAX’s development.

From: Boeing Fought Lion Air On Proposed MAX Simulator Training Requirement
Sean Broderick January 10, 2020

 

[gmax137]

the priority Boeing placed on positioning the MAX as nearly the same as its predecessor, the 737 Next Generation (NG)

I believe (with no knowledge nor evidence) that SW airlines made this a de-facto design requirement and once that was established it was repeated as necessary by everyone involved.

 

[Vanadium 50]

Do we know when these emails were sent? I've read "late 2018 and early 2019", which sure seems like after one incident and possibly both. It matters.

 

[gleem]

That depends on what problems they were referring to. I read several articles and found little or no context for those quotes.

You can read 117 emails and internal communications here https://seekingalpha.com/news/35308...p=0&utm_medium=email&utm_source=seeking_alpha

I found the particular comment about monkeys etc. It apparently had to do with the flight management computer not noting the altitude. I missed the location of the other comment.

 

[morrobay]

That depends on what problems they were referring to. I read several articles and found little or no context for those quotes.

I have seen nothing so far that says anyone was aware of the bug in the MCAS software.

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-48174797

https://www.extremetech.com/extreme...7-max-was-dangerous-and-kept-it-flying-anyway

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/10/18/boe...is-concerned-it-was-misled-about-737-max.html

Here are several reports that you have seen nothing of.

 

[morrobay]

Engineers in 2017 discovered that a software related warning light failed on 80% of the 737 MAX. But the company chose not to fix it.($) The next year a Lion Air jet suffered the malfunction the alert was designed to detect and crashed in the Java Sea. https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...ix-737-max-cockpit-light-may-draw-faa-penalty
I rest my case. Take them away.