Will the Expanding Universe Eventually Become Invisible?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the nature of the expanding universe, particularly the implications of its acceleration and the concept of an observable horizon. Participants explore whether galaxies will eventually become invisible due to this expansion and what that means for our understanding of the universe's size and structure.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests that the universe's expansion and acceleration, attributed to dark energy, could lead to galaxies becoming invisible as they move beyond our observable horizon.
  • Another participant challenges the notion of the universe having a definitive beginning, arguing that current models do not universally support the idea that time does not extend back before the Big Bang.
  • A third participant agrees that the universe is likely much larger than the observable portion, emphasizing that the observable universe is not a fixed quantity and changes as more data is collected.
  • This participant also notes that the edge of the observable universe is not a physical boundary but rather a conceptual limit based on the light we can currently receive.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the nature of the universe's beginning and the implications of its expansion. There is no consensus on whether the universe's past can be definitively characterized, nor on the future visibility of galaxies.

Contextual Notes

Participants acknowledge limitations in current models and the dependence on observational data to refine understanding of the universe's structure and behavior.

Whateverworks
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Hello.

I've been having some thoughts about the universe and I want to share them.

If we consider a couple of facts;

1) The Universe haven't been here forever. (It had a beginning)
2) The speed of light is NOT infinite but have a speed at 3x10^5 km/s

With those two facts we get an "edge" of the universe.
We also know that the universe its expanding and actually is accelerating in its expansion which is a consequence of what I would guess would be "dark energy".

Our horizon in the universe is about 14 billion years, we don't know if the universe is twice our horizon or infinitely larger than our horizon same if your a ship at sea you got a horizon with you in the center of a perfect circle but you don't know how much bigger the ocean is than your horizon.

My curiosity is;

The universe is an accelerating expanding place and at SOME point galaxy's would be so far away from each other that they will become invisible and we won't be able to see or detect the cosmos as we can now.

Am I correct or have I completely misunderstood something?

/WeW
 
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Whateverworks said:
... facts;

1) The Universe haven't been here forever. (It had a beginning)
...

facts?

I don't think it was ever taken as fact. Until around 2005 it was kind of the preferred opinion. People thought and talked along those lines ("before bang is meaningless") without conclusive evidence.

As of now, however, there is no scientific reason to take as a fact that time does not continue on back before bang. Some models break down at bang, others do not. AFAIK, the different models still have to be sorted out by confronting them with observational data.
 
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Whateverworks said:
...
Our horizon in the universe is about 14 billion years, we don't know if the universe is twice our horizon or infinitely larger than our horizon same if your a ship at sea you got a horizon with you in the center of a perfect circle but you don't know how much bigger the ocean is than your horizon.
...

That's essentially right. In standard cosmology it is taken for granted that the U is much bigger than the portion of it that we can currently observe.

The whole U is what cosmologists study, using theoretical models which are fitted to the small observable piece of it.

The "observable universe" just means the part that we have so far received light from (or other signals, other sorts of waves we might try to figure out how to detect). As time goes on the amount that is "observable" very slowly changes---as more data comes in---so the "observable" is not a definite fixed amount. We just think of it that way because percentagewise it changes slowly.

Currently we are receiving light (and making careful maps of it) that was emitted from matter which is now estimated to be 45 billion lightyears from us. When it emitted the light we are now receiving this matter was 41 million lightyears from us. In other words that matter which we are now observing is now about 1100 times more distant than it was when it emitted the light.

You can think of that matter as roughly speaking sitting on our "horizon" if you like. It is approximately at the edge of the "observable" region of the U.

But to get a sensible workable model of the U we have to include the rest as well. Because what is beyond horizon affects what we can see. Different observers of course have different horizons, and are causally influenced by their own regions. The edge of the observable is not a real physical edge. You pointed out the analogy of the ship at sea, which is a good one.
 
Thanks for your reply's Marcus. I will do some "homework" now :)
 
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