Would a Bird Be Able to Fly on The Moon?

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around whether a bird could fly on the moon, considering it is equipped with a breathing apparatus. Participants explore the implications of the moon's lack of atmosphere and the forces acting on a bird during flight.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Assumption checking, Conceptual clarification

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants question the necessity of an atmosphere for flight and discuss the forces acting on a bird. Some consider the implications of Newton's laws in the context of the moon's gravity and lack of air. Others raise analogies to other scenarios, such as a fish swimming without water.

Discussion Status

The discussion is active, with various interpretations being explored regarding the conditions required for flight. Some participants offer insights into the physics involved, while others express uncertainty about the implications of the laws of motion in this context.

Contextual Notes

There is a notable focus on the assumptions regarding the moon's environment, particularly the absence of air, and how this affects the ability of a bird to fly. Participants also reference the need for clarity in the original question posed.

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Homework Statement



The bird is fitted with a breathing apparatus, released on the moon could it fly?

Homework Equations



It doesn't violate any of Newtons laws, but I could be missing something.

The Attempt at a Solution



The best answer that is listed is that the question is in error.
 
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Does the moon have an atmosphere?
 
What are the forces acting on a bird as it flies?
 
Justhelp said:
It doesn't violate any of Newtons laws, but I could be missing something.
What's your reasoning?
 
The moon has gravity. And I don't see how the laws of motion could be changed.
 
Here is another, a feather and a coin are dropped on the moon from the same height which hits sooner? I know I have to take the moon's gravity into account. Is there a formula to solve this?

I'd like to think they would drop at the same time because of no wind resistince?
 
Justhelp said:
The moon has gravity. And I don't see how the laws of motion could be changed.

The gravitational pull is not what keeps a bird up. How does a bird on Earth stay aloft?
 
By air.. And there is no wind resistance from what I concluded with in the other problem..
 
Justhelp said:
The moon has gravity. And I don't see how the laws of motion could be changed.
The laws of motion are certainly not changed on the moon. Does the moon have what is required for a bird to fly? How do they fly anyway?
 
  • #10
Can a fish swim without water? Can a bird fly without air? Just a hint @ OP.
 
  • #11
No, the bird would not be able to fly. Violating Newtons second law then?
 
  • #12
Justhelp said:
No, the bird would not be able to fly. Violating Newtons second law then?

why do you think a law would be violated?
 
  • #13
The choices are violating Newtons 1st, 2'd, or 3rd law or no gravity on the moon or the question is in error. I think the 2'd law because accel=net force/ mass, accel. would be low enough the bird could not fly? I am still thinking.
 
  • #14
I have to right now. Thank you for any further help.
 
  • #15
If those are the only options, the question was not posed with the correct answer.

If the question is posed as "IF a bird were to fly on the moon, what laws of physics would be violated", then there is a solution. If there is no air, there is nothing for a bird to apply any forces to to keep aloft.
 
  • #16
Technicality: the bird could be placed in a low orbit around the moon complete with breathing apparatus.

So yes, a bird *can be made to* fly astronautically on the moon but not using its innate biological capacity for aerodynamic flight.
 
  • #17
I think it violates Newton's 3rd. Law. Action up reaction none. As in conservation of momentum.
Once you violate the law, it becomes unphysical. If a ghost can push you down, but you can't push him/her back then the ghost is unphysical.
 
Last edited:
  • #18
azizlwl said:
I think it violates Newton's 3rd. Law. Action up reaction none. As in conservation of momentum.

Depends on how you define "fly". How much time should one be in the air in order to "fly".
 
  • #19
dimension10 said:
Depends on how you define "fly". How much time should one be in the air in order to "fly".

If it glides, it needs 3rd law too.
Maybe it just orbiting the moon at low altitude.
Radius of the moon, 1,737.10 km (0.273 Earths)
Acceleration say 1/3 of g.

mg=0.5mv2/r
v≈3km/sec.

I don't know of any bird can fly that fast.
 

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