Would buying an air purifier be helpful for Home/Apt?

[Asymptotic]

Desiccant breathers for gearboxes operate on a similar principle to the Eva-Dry, but are throw-away and not designed for regeneration. The model I've used was rated for 333 ml of water adsorption using 1.88 pounds (853 grams) of cobalt chloride (moisture indicator) treated silica gel beads. Adsorption depends on temperature and RH, and this manufacturer may have engaged in a bit of apple polishing with their specs insofar as 18% to 23% is the typical maximum water adsorption range by weight for silica gel at 25°C/40% RH.

The $14.97 (USD) Eva-Dry model E-333 specs are for use in an area of up to 333 cubic feet (equivalent to a cube of about 7 feet on each side), with 20 to 30 days (4 to 6 ounces of water adsorption) between regenerations, and an 8 to 10 hour regeneration cycle in a well-ventilated area.

Color change is from orange to green which strongly suggests a methyl violet indicator chemistry. The rule of thumb is for an oven temperature of 255°F (124°C) applied for 12 hours to re-generate fully spent gel beads, and gives an idea how hot the Eva-Dry desiccant compartment becomes during regen.

Based on the reviews they do a good job removing excessive moisture from small, enclosed areas such as closets and gun safes, but aren't very effective in large open areas.

4 to 6 ounces of water adsorption is about 118 milliliter to 177 milliliters. The aforementioned dehumidifier rated at 70 pints (33122 milliliters) removes about the same amount of water as anywhere from 280 to 187 model E-333 Eva-Dry units. At $14.97 each, this is a purchase cost of about $4200 to $2800 USD.

To put this in perspective, a source of bulk silica gel prices plain, non-indicating 2 to 4 mm beads at about $90 USD, orange (methyl violet based) indicating beads at $140, and blue (cobalt chloride based) indicating beads at $153 per 55 pound drum.

 

[Asymptotic]

they break and spill stupid (cancerous?) beads all over the place.

I'm not sure about plain silica gel, but the EU recently banned cobalt chloride based (blue-to-pink) indicators regarding cancer concerns, and the gearbox breather manufacturer I'd mentioned previously was beginning a transition to the orange-to-green type.

 

[mister mishka]

i had this very bad mucus cough for months, fearing i would end up with chronic bronchitis i bought an air purifier for 90 euros. it has a coal and hepa filter, uv light and mechanical fan with different speeds (and has NO ionizer). just after a few days, my cough cleared up completely :)

 

[kyphysics]

It really was meant from a pedagogical perspective, not as an admonishment to anyone, you or otherwise.

No worries.

There's a lot of subtleties, but I was strongly hinting at this when I mentioned the role of prior information.

My own view is that it may be less about knowing the intricacies of fishing, but instead having a framework for how to think about it. The classic saying involving fishing, not frameworks, is pithier though, I'm afraid.

I agree on your car example, but it's still good to have a framework for what goes on with car mechanics so you don't get ripped off. Similar idea with the eva dry. Similar idea in dealing with a lot of things.

That's interesting. I think you're right.

You at least want a common sense or basic level of understanding of how the world works, so that you don't get ripped off, as you say, or don't do really dumb stuff. That's the whole point of education: a.) having some knowledge of the world + b.) being able to think critically/logically so as to solve at least some simple everyday life problems.

Some basic literacy in physics, biology, history, politics, etc. is needed for human survival if nothing else. I guess someone can debate about where to draw the line in terms of energy/time spent on learning various things, but I agree with the basic premise above.

your handle has "physics" in it -- so I made a guess. There's real value in learning to think this way, again at the framework level. Maybe some motivation to take more STEM courses?

Heh. I'd love to in an ideal world man! I actually just wrote not too long ago in another thread (about fast growing future jobs) that I think in some world where all of one's basic survival needs are met, maybe we'd see people pursuing those "useless" degrees (philosophy, art history, gender studies, etc.) more. I've always felt "useless" was a relative term and we simply live in a world where meeting our basic human needs (food/clothing/shelter/health care) still requires a lot of work and takes up the majority of most people's time. Most people wake up and work 9+ hours a day. Not much time in their free time to do anything else. E.g., it took me two weeks to learn the nuances of doing my taxes (first time self-preparer) this year and that was during my free time. In a possible futuristic world, where one didn't have to worry about food and the basics of life, maybe we'd all focus more of our energies on these intellectual topics.

I try to learn about other subjects while driving and working out. I listen to podcasts of subjects of every background. And I enjoy discussing various ideas in a place like this.

re: screen name
I do that with lots of sites for easy screen name recollection. I'll put some aspect of the site's title into my screen name. Some people just use the exact same sn across sites. That's another way to do it.

For what it's worth, I actually purchased a couple of those Eva Drys a while back -- I think the minis for $15. Sometimes for small dollar stuff on Amazon I don't put enough thought in first. They have a hook and are meant to be hung (e.g. in your closet). But if they get bumped and fall onto a hardwood floor they break and spill stupid (cancerous?) beads all over the place.

The framework I mentioned above was more of a post-mortem thought I had a while back on why they didn't do much. It's of course preferable to do a pre-mortem and avoid the whole thing to begin with. But, a second best is to at least do a post-mortem... not something that many people do. I don't think most people do much of either actually.

Cancerous beads - no thanks! Yeah, I think I'll avoid those.

Agree that we should do a post-purchases analysis of things! It's tempting when you see a $15.00 item to just get it. I appreciate everyone's feedback on these various items, as it's given me some useful things to consider!

 

[kyphysics]

I think what you are missing is that this forum isn't about 'quick answers'. The global guidelines state:

Does that apply to "General Chat," though? I figured this was more relaxed and not like the homework help section, where we had to show proof of working out a problem first before asking for help.

http://blacktoxicmolds.com/bleach-kill-mold.php

Explains why it seems to work fine on everything in my shower (stone, sealant and grout which was sealed with stone sealer).

Wouldn't vinegar attack many stone tiles (eg Travertine which I think is limestone like).

Here is what I came across, CWatters (see link and quoted text below):

https://www.servicemasterrestore.com/blog/mold-damage/mold-myths-will-vinegar-kill-mold/

Does Bleach Kill Mold?
The idea that bleach can kill mold is a myth! In reality, bleach only kills surface mold, not the membrane that lives underneath the black, fuzzy growth. This mold membrane is where the heart of the problem truly lies. If you try using bleach to kill mold, it will usually return with a vengeance. The chemical structure of bleach makes it unable to penetrate porous surfaces like drywall or wood, which means that mold membranes will simply retreat deeper into whatever surface they're on to avoid the chemical. Once first exposed to bleach, the mold recognizes it as a threat and can actually use it as a fungal food to grow more rapidly. That's right – using bleach to kill mold can actually feed the problem! The Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) does not recommend using bleach to kill or remove mold, except under special conditions when supervised by a professional. If you want to effectively eradicate mold in your home, bleach simply won't cut it.

Does Vinegar Kill Mold?
Just because bleach is out doesn't mean you don't already have something in your pantry that can effectively kill mold. That old bottle of vinegar in your cupboard is actually a powerful tool. White vinegar is a mild acid that is known to kill roughly 82 percent of mold species, and it can even help prevent mold outbreaks in the future. Use vinegar to eradicate small outbreaks of mold by following these simple steps:

1. Make sure you are wearing protective gear, including a mask, goggles and gloves, to protect yourself from direct exposure to mold.
2. Pour plain, white distilled vinegar into a spray bottle. Because mold is such a resilient force, it's best not to dilute the vinegar.
3. Spray the vinegar directly onto the mold, and let it sit for at least an hour without rinsing or scrubbing so that the vinegar gets completely absorbed by the mold.
4. If scrubbing is necessary, make a baking soda solution to use after the vinegar. Combine 1 teaspoon of baking soda with 2 cups of water in a spray bottle and shake until thoroughly mixed.
5. Spray the baking soda solution directly onto the mold and vigorously scrub the area with a scrubbing brush or scouring pad. Safety tip: be sure to use protective gear while scrubbing to prevent direct contact with the mold.
6. Rinse the area with clean, warm water.
7. Spray the area again with either the vinegar or the baking soda solution and let the chemicals dry naturally to help kill any remaining mold and prevent regrowth. The strong smell of vinegar will naturally fade within a few hours.

1. 
   
   Also, here is the EPA mold link from that website piece:

https://www.epa.gov/mold

There's a whole page/section from the EPA dedicated to mold. I've seen a few other websites say that bleach killing mold is a myth as well and also the recommendation of vinegar. Not sure how true the vinegar recommendation is! Trying to find out!

EDIT: I see your quote post actually distinguishes between porous and non-porous surfaces now, CWatters. So, my post was maybe irrelevant. But, it's still good to know perhaps for other people wondering about this topic.

EDIT 2: I'm also not sure why there is a random "1." above. It keeps appearing in my post no matter how many times I've tried to delete it. Weird.

 

[NTL2009]

Does Bleach Kill Mold?
The idea that bleach can kill mold is a myth! In reality, bleach only kills surface mold,
...

That language is really imprecise. They are wrong. Bleach does kill mold. The next sentence even says that. You should look for better sources, methinks. Adding "only surface" doesn't change the fact that bleach kills mold.It's like a serial killer telling the Judge "But I never killed anyone (in the subway)!"

So bleach does kill mold. Period. The question is, will it keep it from growing back? That's a separate question. Understanding the difference will help find the solution (no pun intended) for a specific scenario.

Does that apply to "General Chat," though? I figured this was more relaxed and not like the homework help section, where we had to show proof of working out a problem first before asking for help. ...

I suppose things are looser here (I don't pay much attention to the category, since I generally click from the "new posts" page.). But I still think it is helpful to you (everyone) to put some effort into thinking about the problem before you look for answers from others. Otherwise, how do you know if their info is any good? I think that's part of what got you into some trouble earlier. And as was mentioned earlier, a little thought process on that Eva-dry stuff would have made it clear that's not going to do the job in a large area.

BTW, those EVa-Dry type products are used effectively by people with 'kegerators'. When you convert a freezer to beer temperatures, you no longer get a de-frost cycle (it deactivates a few degrees above freezing), so you don't get de-humidifying. But that's an enclosed space with little air flow. World of difference.

 

[Rive]

Here is what I came across

You are some seriously vulnerable to the basic clickbait techniques. That site is trying to sell some service/product. And to get attention, they are using a carefully imprecise language to make you believe they are something more than any other competitor.
But that's just wrong. By using these techniques they are less than any of their competitors. At least, far less honest.

 

[kyphysics]

You are some seriously vulnerable to the basic clickbait techniques. That site is trying to sell some service/product. And to get attention, they are using a carefully imprecise language to make you believe they are something more than any other competitor.
But that's just wrong. By using these techniques they are less than any of their competitors. At least, far less honest.

They might be wrong about bleach not killing all of mold on porous surfaces. I don’t know. I’m still in the discovery phase of things.

However, merely being a business or using persuasion to get a point across doesn’t necessarily make one wrong (both factually and morally). Any good business should be proud to sell their services. And persuasion is not the same as manipulation. Steven K. Scott defines persuasion as trying to get people to do what’s in their own best interests, while manipulation is trying to get someone to do what’s in your best interest only (not both sides). If this company’s statements are factually accurate, I don’t hold it against them that they may be advertising their business services. I mean, how else would we know to use a professional and not DIY when it’s unwise to?

So, yes, they may not be academic scientists with zero business goals behind their statements, but that has no bearing on the truth of their statements.

 

[Rive]

So, yes, they may not be academic scientists with zero business goals behind their statements, but that has no bearing on the truth of their statements.

..and also even a dead clock will be precise at least twice a day...

What I can't really understand is, that why are you repeatedly trying to advocate clickbait here?

 

[kyphysics]

..and also even a dead clock will be precise at least twice a day...

What I can't really understand is, that why are you repeatedly trying to advocate clickbait here?

Wow. You really are trying to provoke me aren’t you? I won’t respond back to you as a poster ever again should you not heed this warning. Don’t falsely or erroneously accuse me of something.

Don’t. And don’t be argumentative for the sake of being argumentative.

I’m not posting clickbait, as I JUST got suspended for something related to a misunderstanding related to that and returned to this forum yesterday. Don’t go around talking like that and end up getting me kicked out for good! MODS, you see that I’m not playing around here! No one had better falsely accuse me of anything.

If you think something is factually incorrect about their statements, do point it out. I don’t see it, but am open to being corrected if they are factually wrong. They say that on porous surfaces mold won’t be entirely killed by bleach and often returns worse by feeding off the bleach. They give reasoning for these assertions. You are welcome to show me how they are wrong and to deal with their reasoning, as opposed to a general statement saying they are wrong (without saying how and why). Do you see how that’s unhelpful and why saying I am advocating clickbait is inflammatory and an aggressive way of socially speaking to someone?

 

[NTL2009]

...

I’m not posting clickbait, as I JUST got suspended for something related to a misunderstanding related to that and returned to this forum yesterday. ...

Then you should be more careful. We can't determine intent, but it fits your previous pattern that got you in trouble "Here's some info I found! <link>". You don't put the slightest effort into determining if the info is valid or not, but link to it anyway. Just like those other 'financial guru' links - you could have easily done some basic research and seen the info was bad before posting links to it.

If you don't understand that, my Crystal Ball tells me your time on this forum is short. And you will have a tough time in the real world as well - you really should learn some basic methods for evaluating information that you come across.

 

[kyphysics]

What info. here is incorrect? Point it out. Or, is it that there isn’t anything wrong with their mold statements?

Re:financial thread I disagree that it was bad info,but haven’t had time to respond to posts in that thread. I also told a moderator I’d take a break from it also for the time being. So I disagree with you there as well.

 

[NTL2009]

What info. here is incorrect? Point it out. Or, is it that there isn’t anything wrong with their mold statements?

Re:financial thread I disagree that it was bad info,but haven’t had time to respond to posts in that thread. I also told a moderator I’d take a break from it also for the time being. So I disagree with you there as well.

Read my post #36.

I'm not going to re-hash the financial thread, and it wouldn't be fair if you are taking a break from that, but just reread it, some of us pointed out clear issues with the 'guru' info (i.e. don't use 'average' annual returns, unless you are trying to trick me).

 

[kyphysics]

Yeah, you were nitpicking the language they used and not applying common sense SAT reading comprehension for everyday vernacular (which is why I temporarily ignored that useless post).

I could do that too and be a “word Nazi” and play games and waste people’s time here saying they are wrong on stuff they clearly had no intention of meaning to say. But, I apply some charity to reading and interpreting other’s thoughts and basic reading comprehension techniques used to communicate in everyday situations. You made a fuss about nothing above, as I already pointed out to CWatters what I missed in his post. Did you read that part?

You post a lot of angry inflammatory stuff that doesn’t give people basic charity of interpretation.

P.s. using a crappy iPad keyboard atm...sorry if I’m sounding rude... not intended, but have to type fast and can’t spend time parsing my words better...these keyboard take forever to type they suck

 

[NTL2009]

I'm done with you.

 

[russ_watters]

Thread has run its course and is locked. Thanks everyone for the help.