Would you hire a graduate of Honestrosewater University?

[honestrosewater]

I don't think you understand. The point of student loans is to pay your tuition and living expenses (rent, food, etc.) while you bust your ass in school.

I could get enough money for that? Hahahaha... that would be super, yes.

By the way, you might well qualify for some massive subsidized financial aid, like grants. Have you considered filing a FAFSA just to find out?

I started to a while ago, but as part of the registration, males under 27 have to sign up with the Selective Service, and females are not even allowed to... which I think is unfair and got me sidetracked the last time I started looking into that. But, yeah, if I can get enough money to go to school full-time and not have to work, that would be perfect. I will get on that right away. Hah. Wow.

 

[chroot]

I could get enough money for that? Hahahaha... that would be super, yes.

That's generally how it's supposed to work. It's unfortunate that the so-called "expected family contribution" is non-zero even for people whose parents are dead-beats and really don't help them at all. You should be old enough to be off your parents' tax returns, though, and will probably have an EFC of zero. The cheapest way to go is then to live on campus and get a meal plan through your university. You'll probably get a little spending money, too, but there's nothing quite so nice as having all your meals paid for for an entire semester. Dorm life is not exactly "cozy," but it's really a pretty incredible experience that I think everyone could benefit from socially.

I started to a while ago, but as part of the registration, males under 27 have to sign up with the Selective Service, and females are not even allowed to... which I think is unfair and got me sidetracked the last time I started looking into that.

Trust me, you don't want to be in selective service.

- Warren

 

[honestrosewater]

That's generally how it's supposed to work.

Sweetness. I'm glad I started this thread now.

Trust me, you don't want to be in selective service.

Ideally, no. But what justification is there for discriminating between males and females? People on the list wouldn't even necessarily be drafted. I want equality all the time, not only when it happens to be beneficial. I actually started https://www.physicsforums.com/showthread.php?t=114285" when I first found out about this. Wow, that was a year ago. Yipes. Time flies...

 

[chroot]

Ideally, no. But what justification is there for discriminating between males and females? People on the list wouldn't even necessarily be drafted. I actually started https://www.physicsforums.com/showthread.php?t=114285" when I first found out about this. Wow, that was a year ago. Yipes. Time flies...

It's just BS anyway. Any administration that actually invoked selective service would have hell to pay. Just click the button and get on with your life. Refusing to accept financial aid and therefore spending your life in restaurant hell would not constitute a very meaningful form of protest anyway.

- Warren

 

[honestrosewater]

Refusing to accept financial aid and therefore spending your life in restaurant hell would not constitute a very meaningful form of protest anyway.

Yeah, I probably agree (I will have to think about it some at least, but yeah). Wow, you just made, like, my whole year, maybe my whole life. How did I not know this before? Anywho, thanks! I guess I owe you one or something.

 

[chroot]

Yeah, I probably agree (I will have to think about it some at least, but yeah). Wow, you just made, like, my whole year, maybe my whole life. How did I not know this before? Anywho, thanks! I guess I owe you one or something.

Hey, it's not just me! I honestly think you'd totally love undergrad school, and grow in ways you never thought possible. And if you're really as prepared as you say you are, you might be able to finish in record time, if you choose.

Just to be clear on one point though: if you ever think you're in danger of having to drop out because you're not making ends meet financially, call your financial aid office! Be proactive and vocal and you'll get what you need.

Another point: if the city or town where your school permits it, sell your car and get a bike. If you plan on living on campus, there's no reason to be paying for car insurance and registration and what not. Live as simply as possible (but no simpler), as Einstein would have said.

- Warren

 

[Mk]

So. Uh, why didn't we decide to just apply to normal school? Or is that what will be done now? What about before?

 

[honestrosewater]

So. Uh, why didn't we decide to just apply to normal school? Or is that what will be done now? What about before?

That's what I'll do now.

When I first left school, I thought I was going to be a writer, so I didn't need no stinking school, blah, blah. You know how dumb kids are. It wasn't until 10-09-01 that I had one of those epiphany things while reading a "day in the life" article by a cog sci grad student at MIT that I realized (a non-sucky) school was exactly where I wanted to be.

I initially was going to apply to normal school as an undergrad. So I switched to a job where I had a more regular schedule and started doing what I needed to complete my applications. There is actually a lot missing if you never attended high school, have 0 high school credits (= no grades), no teacher recommendations, etc. I actually even moved to Cambridge when I decided that MIT was where I really wanted to go (plus, Boston has almost as many schools as it has bars), but I got screwed by some perfectly friendly and clever but not entirely reliable pothead frat boys (not in that way). So I moved back to Florida, got my GED, found PF, blah, blah, you can read the rest in my biography when I become a famous cunning linguist.

So... I have been working at it. I have also been educating myself in the meantime as well, and it just happens that my self-education has progressed faster than getting everything else in place. I didn't know that I could get enough money to go to school full-time and not have to work full-time also. Making that work is hard when you have this huge "high-school dropout" stamp on your forehead.

So, yeah, stay in school, kids! Unless you want to be a writer. No, wait...

Haha, pardon my sloppy punctuation and sentence structure. I'm just so excited!111 :tongue3: :buggrin:

 

[hypnagogue]

I don't know how linguistics research works, but I would also strongly recommend trying to volunteer in a professor's research efforts if at all possible. At the very least you will get some first-hand experience with what it is like to work in the field, plus an all-important recommendation for graduate applications. In a best case scenario, given enough time and effort on your part and given a professor who is in need of that time and effort, you might have the opportunity to get your name on a paper or two.

 

[Evo]

HRW, can you get into anything other than a Junior College with a GED? I always thought regular universities required two years of junior college before they would consider someone with a GED. Have you checked out requirements?

It looks like you can get into a good state school with a GED and passing the ACT.

 

[honestrosewater]

I don't know how linguistics research works, but I would also strongly recommend trying to volunteer in a professor's research efforts if at all possible.

Ah, that is a great idea. Thanks.

It looks like you can get into a good state school with a GED and passing the ACT.

Yeah, I don't recall right now. The requirements, I think, are usually more focused on which classes you should have taken (math through calculus, two terms of foreign language, etc.), especially at the more selective schools. For example, I know that MIT doesn't even require a high school diploma. For the places where it does matter, I recall it being among the only requirements.

Also, in Florida, by passing the GED tests, you are awarded a regular high school diploma. It is just awarded by the State of Florida rather than whoever else usually awards them, the counties, I suppose. The test is called the GED, but you earn a regular diploma. Of course, they don't magically derive a transcript, extracurricular activities, and everything else, so it's mostly just a technicality, I guess. You get a class ranking, and that's about it. Anywho...

I don't know about the ACT, but I have studied for the SATs plenty a while ago. I ended up tearing my Achilles tendon the day before I was supposed to take the test, so I missed it and haven't signed up again. This was right before they changed it recently. But I prepared a lot and was expecting an 780-800 on the language Arts and at least a 750 on the Math part. I did manage to get 800s on both several times before signing up for the test, but they were just practice of course. You can lose point so easily on the Math part. Blarg. I imagine I could score similarly on the ACT.

If I were depending almost entirely on aid, I imagine would probably stay in the state. I'm not sure if I'm eligible, but Florida has a nice scholarship program called Bright Futures. None of the local schools, around Tampa, have linguistics departments. But the University of Florida actually has a nice one, and they have a really cool honors program that I was really excited about at one point. Of course, I could always study math locally for a while to start since I am going to need a lot of that anyway. Plus, I loves it. :!)

Actually, there is a local college that has another special program where I can earn all of my Humanities, Arts, and Social Sciences credits for an AA in just three interdisciplinary classes. It sounds super interesting. I registered there a while ago, and I've taken their placement tests already and qualified for those special classes and their honors program too. (The lady said that I actually got the highest scores she had ever seen (two perfect scores too), which I'm not sure is a good or a bad thing. I'd like to be somewhere that can really challenge me and such, but I guess I can find ways to challenge myself anyway.) So... who knows. I'm having a hard time sitting still long enough to work on this aid stuff at the moment. Yee!

 

[Surrealist]

I'll be honest. The job you describe sounds to me like a PhD level position. Anyone on these boards who has finished a PhD will tell you that it relies on 99% blood, sweat and tears... and 1% raw talent. In other words, those three letters behind a person's name are more of a right-of-passage to get paid for doing original research than a proof of one's intelligence.

Anyway, you seem like a very intelligent person. If I were you, I would apply for a job as an applications programmer and work your way up to computer theorist... if that is your ultimate goal. Although application programmer jobs are difficult to get these days, thanks to global outsourcing, you can sometimes get a company to sponser you to go to college in your spare time. Since you have learned so much on your own, college would probably be a good review. I wouldn't worry about repeating education. Fundamental principles usually stick better the second or third time around. Besides, I have observed first-hand that some international students have actually previously earned the very degrees they are working on in the US before leaving their home countries.

If I were you, I would list "home school" under the education part of your resume. In place of the traditional college education, you could list specific names of textbooks you have read and computer languages you have taught yourself.

Like I said, you seem very intelligent. Is there any chance you could take an IQ test and get yourself a MENSA membership? That would help work as an "eye catcher".

Just remember that a resume is nothing more than a ticket to a job interview. If you don't look good on paper, in the eyes of the hiring manager, you will not get the interview... even if you are the most intelligent person who ever lived.

 

[mathwonk]

You cannot get a degree unless you are accepted, and you canot be accepted unless you have the usual prereqs, so chroot is probably right.

Note his advice to exemopt as much as possible using the allowed methods.

E.g. when i wanted to obtain entrance to grad school at UWash in 1973 or so, I simply showed up and took their PhD quals and passed them.

This kind of thing immediately convinces them you are qualified, when you outperform their own students, but it is hopeless to simply say you have been studying on your own and quite effectively.The truth is most people who say this are wrong, even if you are not. So you need to give them some way to realize you are who you are.

Or just take one course and blow the top off it. To become viable, you must show you can pass high on a standardized measure. You do not need to do everything, but you need to do enough to obtain an advocate.

By the way, if it makes you feel better, i already believe you are strong, just based on my memory of posts here by you, and I have a lot of experience in rating talent.so the answer to your original question is "yes", but only because I already know you. strangers will mostly say "no".

But you have so ething most people do not, namely talent, determination, and brains. As my old high school teacher's husband, a college math professor, told me after I flunked out of college, "get back in there, you can do this".

PS: WE all fear failure, but we all also fail from time to time, that is normal. The harder the task the more likely is failure. But failure is only temporary, if you try again. Success is inevitable for someone with your gifts.

When I heard Karen Uhlenbeck speak at the ICM in Tokyo in 1990, I was struck by her courage and candor in speaking about some of her biggest "failures". Even those shed light on problems, if they were good honest, hard efforts.

 

[honestrosewater]

I'll be honest. The job you describe sounds to me like a PhD level position. Anyone on these boards who has finished a PhD will tell you that it relies on 99% blood, sweat and tears... and 1% raw talent. In other words, those three letters behind a person's name are more of a right-of-passage to get paid for doing original research than a proof of one's intelligence.

Mathematical linguist? Yes, I want to earn a PhD in the field and do original research. I would also love to teach. I have some friends in grad school and realize that it is hard work.

Is there any chance you could take an IQ test and get yourself a MENSA membership? That would help work as an "eye catcher".

Yeah, I have considered that before. Something about it is not quite me. I'm not really sure what it says. I actually had an IQ test in elementary school and scored high enough to enter the gifted program. I checked a while ago, when I was considering joining Mensa to put it on a resume or school application, and found out that that required a score at least two standard deviations above the mean, which, glancing at the accepted scores that they list, looks to be what they require (I don't know which test I was given). I think that Mensa might accept previous scores from any time, so I might not even have to take a test to qualify. But, that's the thing, what does it say if I don't even have to take a test to qualify, and it depends on something that I did twenty years ago?

I mean, I don't know... I'll think about it.

Um... on a side note... does it sound like I'm trying to boast or something? I mean, haha. I realize I tend to score "high", so it might sound that way. But... eh, I'm just stating facts. I don't make up these tests, and I don't presume to be able to judge them or know what they measure, and I don't expect anyone to care what I score other than the people who have decided to use these scores for something. I mean... haha, I don't know. I'm just saying that, from what I know about myself and from past performance on test and such that other people have devised, I think that I would do very well in school and be very happy. It's getting back into the system that seems incredibly daunting. Meh, whatever. I don't really even feel right asking this. :derp:

Just remember that a resume is nothing more than a ticket to a job interview. If you don't look good on paper, in the eyes of the hiring manager, you will not get the interview... even if you are the most intelligent person who ever lived.

Right. Well, the reason for getting a better job was to have enough time and money to go to school. If I can get enough aid, I don't need to worry about my job search anymore. Even working part-time, perhaps at the school, would be doable. I have no fear whatsoever of hard work. I work hard even when no one else is rewarding me for it.

(I do have something of a fear of failure, though. Sigh.)

 

[honestrosewater]

Thanks, mathwonk, that is very encouraging.

 

[Surrealist]

Right. Well, the reason for getting a better job was to have enough time and money to go to school. If I can get enough aid, I don't need to worry about my job search anymore. Even working part-time, perhaps at the school, would be doable. I have no fear whatsoever of hard work. I work hard even when no one else is rewarding me for it.

(I do have something of a fear of failure, though. Sigh.)

I wish you the best. If things don't work out, there is always one option (depending on your personal ethics)... join the Navy.

I had a roomate my sophomore year of college. He was a really bright guy, but he partied way too much. Long story short... he dropped out of college and joined the Navy. He had a high IQ and demonstrated a high aptitude for learning computer programming. So, they trained him to be a SIGINT hacker. Trust me, those guys know **** they are not capable of teaching in schools.

Anyway, the Navy offers the option of taking college courses in your spare time, and after three to five years of service, you could be eligible to receive the GI Bill.

Many people on these boards are passivists. Like I said, it all depends on your personal set of ethics.

 

[chroot]

Yeah, I have considered that before. Something about it is not quite me. I'm not really sure what it says. I actually had an IQ test in elementary school and scored high enough to enter the gifted program. I checked a while ago, when I was considering joining Mensa to put it on a resume or school application, and found out that that required a score at least two standard deviations above the mean, which, glancing at the accepted scores that they list, looks to be what they require (I don't know which test I was given).

Most of the tests Mensa accepts must have been administered after the age of 16. In general, IQ tests of school children are not reliable indicators of IQ in adulthood. So the answer is no, you cannot simply submit test scores you received in childhood.

Um... on a side note... does it sound like I'm trying to boast or something? I mean, haha. I realize I tend to score "high", so it might sound that way. But... eh, I'm just stating facts. I don't make up these tests, and I don't presume to be able to judge them or know what they measure, and I don't expect anyone to care what I score other than the people who have decided to use these scores for something.

Well, to be honest, it does sound rather like you're boasting. You keep saying things like I haven't taken the SAT, but I expected a score of nearly 1600, and I haven't really even looked at the GRE, but I think I'm competent to become a graduate student directly, and I think I'm eligible to join Mensa because I scored well on an IQ test when I was a child.

This all seems like nothing but idle speculation to me. You've never taken the SAT. You've never taken the ACT. You've never taken the GRE. You've never taken a GRE subject test. You've never taken an IQ test as an adult. You've apparently never even taken any undergraduate-level coursework. You've never published a paper, or participated in any graduate-level research. Yet you seem completely cavalier about simply asserting that you'd do phenomenally on all these things.

I'm not saying you won't... but c'mon. Go take the tests already, then boast. You're trying to find some way to demonstrate your talents, right?

- Warren

 

[honestrosewater]

Well, to be honest,

Thank you.

it does sound rather like you're boasting. You keep saying things like I haven't taken the SAT, but I expected a score of nearly 1600, and I haven't really even looked at the GRE, but I think I'm competent to become a graduate student directly, and I think I'm eligible to join Mensa because I scored well on an IQ test when I was a child.

Yeah, I did realize that I had been saying stuff like that a lot. That's why I asked. I think I might have been trying to convince myself of my potential a bit -- I have some pretty big doubts about how well I could actually perform at these things, for some of the reasons that you mention below -- but who knows. Maybe I was just being jerky.

Sorry if I was being jerky.

This all seems like nothing but idle speculation to me. You've never taken the SAT. You've never taken the ACT. You've never taken the GRE. You've never taken a GRE subject test. You've never taken an IQ test as an adult. You've apparently never even taken any undergraduate-level coursework. You've never published a paper, or participated in any graduate-level research. Yet you seem completely cavalier about simply asserting that you'd do phenomenally on all these things.

Well, I didn't mean to assert that at all. I am trying to guess and make assumptions for planning purposes. And I thought that I was clear about the fact that I was making guesses and assumptions. But, yes, I think I get your point very well. I haven't even taken a class in 9 years. I do homework, but I don't keep track of grades or penalize myself if it's late. And so on. I know. I need to just stop talking and do it.

I'm not saying you won't... but c'mon. Go take the tests already, then boast. You're trying to find some way to demonstrate your talents, right?

Yes, point taken.

 

[mathwonk]

I've known lots of really bright people who hated taking tests. I mayself liked little tests but not big ones, like trying as hard as I could to get a PhD.

I think I didn't want the reality of what came out to sully my idea of how good I was. I think this overperfectionism of what reality will say to our ideals, also affected my bright firends.

Finally one day, very late in my career, I decided, with stimulus from the job market and family mouths to feed, that I waS GOING TO SEE HOW WELL I COULD DO IN THE REal world, and if it was not as good as I imagined, so what?

In 10 short years I went from being asked to elkave grad school, to being an NSF supported postdoc at Harvard, talking to Fields medalists.

I didn't become a Harvard proffesor, noir win the Fields medal myself, but it was easier than the meat lugging job I had been holding down 10 years earlier while in grad school.

And now I get to pontificate to younger smarter people, at the risk of being corrected of course. Thats the risk we take when we step up.by the way people who do well on standardized tests practice for them in advance. i was on the math contest team for years before taking the sat, and i bought old sat practice books for my kids and graded them for them starting when they were 12. doesn't make you smarter, just makes you look smarter on the test.

 

[chroot]

Sorry if I was being jerky.

I hope I didn't hurt your feelings -- I think you're going to do very well in school. I just think you might have to begin at the beginning, like all the rest of us, in undergraduate school. Pick the right school, and enjoy the best four (or three, or two!) years of your life. It's never too late to get started, and it's an experience you will hold dear to your heart for the rest of your life.

- Warren

 

[honestrosewater]

I hope I didn't hurt your feelings

Non, robots don't have feelings.

Thanks, everybody. I'm on my way to library in a sec to pick up some financial aid and test prep stuff. I'm so nervous-excited. Eep!