I have a Question about the big bang theory

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the Big Bang theory, specifically addressing the nature of matter and energy at the universe's inception. Participants explore concepts related to singularities, the state of matter immediately after the Big Bang, and the origins of energy and matter within this framework.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants question how all the matter in the universe could be compressed into a small volume, suggesting that it seems impossible and expressing curiosity about the origins of this matter.
  • One participant introduces the idea of singularities, comparing the Big Bang to a phase transition, where traditional concepts of matter and density may not apply.
  • Another participant states that at the initial moment of the Big Bang, matter did not exist; rather, there was a high-energy state of quarks and antiquarks.
  • There is a discussion about the concept of Bose-Einstein Condensates (BEC), with some arguing that the energy level is more significant than the state of matter.
  • One participant notes that protons and neutrons appeared shortly after the Big Bang, but atoms did not form for approximately 300,000 years.
  • Speculations arise regarding the source of energy in the Big Bang, with references to string theory and the idea of a nearly zero-energy initial state during inflation.
  • Another participant emphasizes that before the universe's expansion, there was no matter or space, and the conditions were too energetic for such entities to exist.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express various viewpoints on the nature of matter and energy at the beginning of the universe, with no consensus reached. Multiple competing theories and interpretations are presented, indicating an unresolved discussion.

Contextual Notes

Participants acknowledge limitations in understanding the role of energy conservation during the early universe and the definitions of energy in the context of gravitational fields.

Daark Nova
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So. how can all the matter in the whole universe be compressed into one small little ball. all the matter in the UNIVERSE. it seems impossible. but I am sure a lot of u guys have a lot of ideas. maybe all the matter in the universe was under a great deal of force. and where the hell did the matter come from any ways. i guess that is the big question.
 
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Try asking a question without big letters and preconceptions. Welcome to PF.
 
Does that mean I can't answer? It's so interesting though . . .

Maybe singularities are involved: Imagine a water creature never having been exposed to ice and wondering how swimming will be affected when the temperature drops below freezing (alright, I mean frozen solid). That involves a "phase-transition" (a type of singularity) and represents an abrupt qualitative change. Perhaps that's so with the Big Bang: Questions of "matter, density, and size" loose meaning across a singularity that could involve physics different from what we've been "exposed" too.

Salty
 
my ideas lead to : no mass = no size.
 
Daark Nova said:
So. how can all the matter in the whole universe be compressed into one small little ball. all the matter in the UNIVERSE. it seems impossible. but I am sure a lot of u guys have a lot of ideas. maybe all the matter in the universe was under a great deal of force. and where the hell did the matter come from any ways. i guess that is the big question.

Right after the initial moment, matter did not exist; protons and neutrons did not exist, what was present was a very high energy bound state of quarks and antiquarks, but too tightly bound to interact. The unified force bosons were all massless and bound in a BEC.
 
what does BEC mean?
 
Daark Nova said:
what does BEC mean?
http://www.colorado.edu/physics/2000/bec/what_is_it.html
 
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BEC is irrelevant. As SA said, the only thing that matters is the energy level. I would only argue that even quarks cannot exist in the primoridial soup that emerged from the initial state. Push the energy level high enough, and even quarks break down.
 
As noted above, there was no matter at the very beginning. Protons & neutrons appeared a split second after the Big Bang event and atoms didn't form for another 300,000 years or so.

So where did all the energy in the Big Bang come from? That is unknown, athough there are many speculations about it. Big Bang Theory is silent on that (it describes the universe AFTER the beginning). String Theory provides a possible explanation that is fairly popular, but it's a long way from being well proven.
 
  • #10
There is indeed one explanation within the big-bang model for the origin of energy and matter, but it is a very vague one: The universe may start with (nearly) zero energy density (nearly zero energy in a finite universe). During inflation, the inflaton, a scalar field with constant energy density, accumulates energy as the volume increases. This energy is borrowed from its own gravitational potential, increasingly negative, since space is expanding with constant energy density and therefore more energy (gravitational mass) is created. I am not sure, but I think the Vilenkin model of tunneling for the origin of the universe relies on the assumption of zero-energy initial state (this is beyond my knowledge). The whole idea is a wild speculation, since we do not know what role the principle of energy conservation plays at such stage and we also do not actually know how to properly define the energy of the gravitational field.
 
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  • #11
"So. how can all the matter in the whole universe be compressed into one small little ball. all the matter in the UNIVERSE. it seems impossible."

Personally, I think the overarching concept to hold onto is that, at the beginning of the universe, there was no matter. It was not simply compressed and under great force, it was not there at all, neither was the fabric of space. The universe was too energetic for mere matter and space to exist.

The universe as it existed 1 millisecond after the big bang had more in common with today's state of the universe than it did with the state of the universe before that. (In other words, the really weird stuff happened in the first millisecond).
 

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