Calculating Force from Moving Air: Is it Possible?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the calculation of force exerted by moving air on an object, exploring the complexities involved in determining this force based on various factors such as relative speed, shape of the object, and flow characteristics. The scope includes theoretical considerations and practical applications related to aerodynamics and fluid dynamics.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants suggest that the relative speed between the object and the air is crucial for determining the force, with a common model being f = -bv, where b is a shape-dependent constant.
  • Others argue that the force exerted by air is highly dependent on the object's shape and the flow of air around it, indicating that a simple formula does not exist.
  • A participant mentions that in ideal conditions, air resistance is proportional to the object's cross-sectional area and the square of its speed.
  • Another contribution proposes calculating the dynamic head using the formula P_D = \frac{1}{2}\rho V^2, which can then be used to derive force based on the area of the object.
  • A later reply questions the method of converting pressure to force, seeking clarification on the relationship between pressure, force, and surface area.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree that the calculation of force from moving air is complex and influenced by multiple factors, but there is no consensus on a simple formula or method due to the varying conditions and assumptions involved.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include the dependence on the shape of the object, the flow characteristics of the air, and the need for experimental determination of constants. The discussion does not resolve the mathematical steps required for specific calculations.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be useful for individuals interested in aerodynamics, fluid dynamics, or those seeking to understand the forces acting on objects in moving air.

infamous_Q
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is there a way to calculate this?
 
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"Air coming at you" or "you coming at air", that's the same thing. Only the relative speed of you to the air is what matters in determining the force.

Usually, it is reasonable to assume the force of friction with the air is of the form f = -bv, where b is a constant depending on the shape of the body which must be determined experimentally.

Now quoting Symon, pp.36:

"However, for small heavy bodies [...], a better approximation may be f = bv²."
 
Obviously yes, but from the way your question is worded you are looking for a simple formula. There is none. The force air exerts on an object is extremely dependent on the way air flows around it. That means the shape of the object is very important. If you're really interested, find some good texts on aerodynamics (and/or hydrodynamics). Be warned, some serious math is involved.
 
Well, in ideal terms, the air resistance is proportional to the cross-sectional area of the object and the square of the speed.
 
If you want to generalize and treat the object as a flat plate in a fluid stream you can calculate the dynamic head, as in [tex]P_D = \frac{1}{2}\rho V^2[/tex]. Assuming your units are correct, that will give you a pressure which can be used to calculate the force over the entire area.
 
k thanks everyone..guess I am going to have to do some research huh.

ah and just a quick question..to go from pressure to force i'd just divide the pressure by how big the surface is correct? (since pressure is usually force exterted / area)
 

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