Is Time Truly Absolute? Investigating Through Thermodynamics

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of absolute time and its relationship with thermodynamics, particularly through the lens of the second law of thermodynamics. Participants explore whether thermodynamics can provide insights into the nature of time, including its irreversibility and the implications of molecular motion.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that the second law of thermodynamics indicates an absolute nature of time due to its association with irreversible processes.
  • Others argue that molecular motion and heat transfer do not satisfy the Lorentz Transformation, suggesting a potential framework for understanding absolute time.
  • A later reply challenges the claim that molecular motion does not satisfy the Lorentz Transformation, asserting that collisions and momentum changes are subject to relativistic transformations.
  • Some participants express skepticism about the idea of absolute time, stating that time is not absolute and that entropy provides a directional arrow rather than a rate of time.
  • One participant humorously suggests that while time may not be absolute, certain values in physics can be considered absolute.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally disagree on the nature of time, with some advocating for the concept of absolute time through thermodynamics, while others firmly reject this notion, emphasizing the relative nature of time as understood in modern physics.

Contextual Notes

There are unresolved assumptions regarding the definitions of absolute time and the implications of thermodynamic principles. The discussion also reflects differing interpretations of relativistic effects on time perception.

zhangyang
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Can we get the absolute time through thermodynamics?

Beacuse the second law of thermodynamics tells us what is irreversible process,it means the absolute nature of time.

The other reason,the movement in heat is the movement of molecules,that motion don't satisfy the Lorentz Transformation,so it can help us make sure the absolute nature of time.

I must say that,in this talk,this "absolute nature of time" is not Newton's absolute time which is independent of matter.I only want to say the absolute nature of same time.
 
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We also have to take into effect that some of the interactions in the Second Law are going to be moving, and therefore, "slower," relative to the observer. Note that we're going to never see anything moving backwards in time in SR. Everyone's just appearing to move slower than the observer.

Note that when I say "moving slower," what I mean is that, for instance, any clocks of that reference frame will appear to run more slowly. I suggest you look a little into General Relativity.
 
zhangyang said:
The other reason,the movement in heat is the movement of molecules,that motion don't satisfy the Lorentz Transformation,so it can help us make sure the absolute nature of time.
This is not correct. The molecules and any collision events do satisfy the Lorentz transformation. Collisions and changes in momentum are also subject to relativistic transformations.
 
Can we get the absolute time through thermodynamics?

doubtful since time is NOT absolute

Beacuse the second law of thermodynamics tells us what is irreversible process,it means the absolute nature of time.

Don't know what you mean, but entropy sets a direction with the arrow of time not a rate.

When you move faster, time slows relative to the slower frame of reference...thermodynamics follws that.
 
doubtful since time is NOT absolute

ict begs to differ, being an absolute value. :wink:
 

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