Maximum inner product between two orthgonal vectors (in standard dot procut))

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the maximum inner product between two orthogonal vectors under a weighted inner product defined by a diagonal matrix of weights. Participants explore the implications of the conditions that both vectors have unit norms and the sum of the weights equals the number of components.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Technical explanation, Debate/contested, Homework-related

Main Points Raised

  • One participant poses a question regarding the maximum absolute value of the inner product between two orthogonal vectors with unit norms under a weighted inner product.
  • Another participant seeks clarification on whether both the standard and weighted norms must equal one, which is confirmed by the original poster.
  • A participant provides a specific case for M=2, deriving relationships between the weights and the angles of the vectors, and suggests that the conditions may not generalize easily to larger M.
  • There is a discussion about the implications of the derived conditions for M=2 and how they might not apply to cases with more components, with a focus on finding weights that maximize the inner product.
  • One participant questions whether this is a homework problem, which is denied, stating that the original poster is a theoretical radar engineer.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the conditions of the problem but express uncertainty about the generalization of the findings to larger values of M. There are competing views on the implications of the derived conditions and whether larger solutions exist.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include the specific case analysis for M=2 and the uncertainty regarding the generalization of the results to larger M, as well as the dependence on the orthogonality and norm conditions imposed on the vectors.

FoldHellmuth
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Hello buddies,

Here is my question. It seems simple but at the same time does not seem to have an obvious answer to me.

Given that you have two vectors \mathbf{u},\mathbf{v}.

  • They are orthogonal \mathbf{u}^T\mathbf{v}=0 by standard dot product definition.
  • They have norm one ||\mathbf{u}||=||\mathbf{v}||=1 by standard dot product definition.
  • Define the weighted inner product as \mathbf{u}^T\left(\begin{matrix}\lambda_1\\&amp;\ddots\\&amp;&amp;\lambda_M\end{matrix}\right)\mathbf{v} where M is the number of components. Then the norm according to this inner product is also one for both vectors \mathbf{u}^T\left(\begin{matrix}\lambda_1\\&amp;\ddots\\&amp;&amp;\lambda_M\end{matrix}\right)\mathbf{u}=<br /> \mathbf{v}^T\left(\begin{matrix}\lambda_1\\&amp;\ddots\\&amp;&amp;\lambda_M\end{matrix}\right)\mathbf{v}=1. Notice the dot product is a particular case where the matrix is the identity.
  • Edit: I forgot to add this \lambda_1+\cdots+\lambda_M=M. It does not make the problem more complicated as it just narrows the possible lambdas.

What is then the maximum inner product (in absolute value) among two vectors satisfying the previous conditions? I.e.
\operatorname{max}\limits_{\mathbf{u},\mathbf{v}} <br /> \left|<br /> \mathbf{u}^T\left(\begin{matrix}\lambda_1\\&amp;\ddots\\&amp;&amp;\lambda_M\end{matrix}\right)\mathbf{v}<br /> \right|Cheers
 
Last edited:
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Do you require that the BOTH norms, the standard one and the weighted one are 1?
 
Hawkeye18 said:
Do you require that the BOTH norms, the standard one and the weighted one are 1?

Yes.
 
Take M=2

write u=\begin{array}{c}\cos(\alpha)\\ \sin(\alpha)\end{array}; v=\begin{array}{c}-\sin(\alpha)\\ \cos(\alpha)\end{array}

The weighted norm is then
u^T\lambda u = \lambda_1 \cos^2(\alpha) + \lambda_2 \sin^2(\alpha) =1
v^T\lambda v = \lambda_1 \sin^2(\alpha) + \lambda_2 \cos^2(\alpha)=1

The sum between these gives \lambda_1+\lambda_2 = 2

The difference gives (\lambda_1 - \lambda_2)(\cos^2(\alpha)-\sin^2(\alpha))=0

Either you use the standard norm, \lambda_1=\lambda_2=1 or \alpha=\pi/2 (or the 3 other quadrants) and no further restrictions on \lambda_{1,2}

Then u^T \lambda v = \frac{1}{2}(\lambda_2 - \lambda_1)

For M>2, find the two \lambda with the largest difference but sum 1 - but I am not entirely sure that there cannot be another, larger solution.

BTW, is this a homework problem?
 
M Quack said:
The weighted norm is then
u^T\lambda u = \lambda_1 \cos^2(\alpha) + \lambda_2 \sin^2(\alpha) =1
v^T\lambda v = \lambda_1 \sin^2(\alpha) + \lambda_2 \cos^2(\alpha)=1

The sum between these gives \lambda_1+\lambda_2 = 2

The difference gives (\lambda_1 - \lambda_2)(\cos^2(\alpha)-\sin^2(\alpha))=0

Either you use the standard norm, \lambda_1=\lambda_2=1 or \alpha=\pi/2 (or the 3 other quadrants) and no further restrictions on \lambda_{1,2}

I think you meant \alpha=\pi/4 (or \pi/4+\pi)
For M=2, the solution only allows these values for the lambdas. I am interested in a generic M which is less obvious.

I actually forgot to mention \lambda_1+\cdots+\lambda_M=M, i.e. the average lambda is one.

M Quack said:
For M>2, find the two \lambda with the largest difference but sum 1 - but I am not entirely sure that there cannot be another, larger solution.

But you derived this conditions imposing orthogonality and norm-1 for vectors of two components. This probably does not carry on for bigger M.

M Quack said:
BTW, is this a homework problem?

Not at all. I am a theoretical radar engineer.
 
Last edited:

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