Air does not intervene with radiation

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the phrase "air does not intervene with radiation," specifically its meaning and implications in the context of thermal radiation and heat transfer. Participants explore the interpretation of this expression and its relevance in thermodynamics, particularly in enclosed spaces.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant seeks clarification on the expression "air does not intervene with radiation," asking for a detailed explanation.
  • Another participant suggests that the phrase implies neglecting thermal radiation absorbed or emitted by the air, noting that this assumption may not significantly impact calculations in smaller indoor environments.
  • Some participants discuss the definition of "intervene," with one providing a rewritten interpretation that suggests it means to "get in the way of or intercept" radiation.
  • There is confusion regarding the use of "intervene" versus "interfere," with participants debating the appropriateness of the terms in this context.
  • One participant emphasizes that redefining a term using the same word leads to circular definitions, questioning the clarity of the rewritten explanation.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the interpretation of the term "intervene" and its implications for understanding radiation in enclosed spaces. There is no consensus on the correct usage or meaning of the term within the context of the discussion.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight potential limitations in understanding the phrase due to varying interpretations of terminology and the assumptions made regarding the role of air in thermal radiation.

mech-eng
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I cannot understand the expression "air does not intervene with radiation". Would you please explain what it means in detail?

" Considering that air does not intervene with radiation and the person is completely enclosed by the surrounding surfaces, the net rate of radiation heat transfer from the person to the surrounding walls, ceiling, and the floor is, from Eq"

Thermodynamics An Engineering Approach

http://www.people.vcu.edu/~vnicule/Part II First Law.htm
 
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That means that they are ignoring any termal radiation absorbed or emitted by the air in the room. If you are indoors and not in a very large room the error from this shouldn't be too large.
 
willem2 said:
That means that they are ignoring any termal radiation absorbed or emitted by the air in the room. If you are indoors and not in a very large room the error from this shouldn't be too large.

I have looked some meanings of intervene. But I cannot find a definition for it for this case

http://www.macmillandictionary.com/dictionary/american/intervene

What could be a definition for intervene with used as in the example?

Thank you.
 
Intervene means 'get in the way of or intercept':

rewritten: Considering that air does not interfere with radiation and does not affect radiation coming from the human in reaching the walls, and the person is completely enclosed by the surrounding surfaces, the net rate of radiation heat transfer from the person to the surrounding walls, ceiling, and the floor is, from Eq
 
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jim mcnamara said:
Intervene means 'get in the way of or intercept':

rewritten: Considering that air does not interfere with radiation and does not affect radiation coming from the human in reaching the walls, and the person is completely enclosed by the surrounding surfaces, the net rate of radiation heat transfer from the person to the surrounding walls, ceiling, and the floor is, from Eq
I am confused. Did you mean intervene instead of interfere? We are discussing intervene.

Thank you.
 
jim mcnamara said:
rewritten: Considering that air does not interfere with radiation
mech-eng said:
I am confused. Did you mean intervene instead of interfere? We are discussing intervene.
I am certain that he meant what he wrote. The rewritten version uses a different word that is close to being a synonym of intervene. When you redefine something, you use different words. If you define a word using the same word, that's a circular definition.
 
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