Amaterasu and GRB221009A: A Comparison of Cosmic Rays and Gamma Ray Bursts

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on the comparison between the Amaterasu cosmic ray and the gamma-ray burst GRB221009A. Participants explore the nature of these phenomena, their energy outputs, and the implications of their classifications. The conversation touches on theoretical and observational aspects of cosmic rays and gamma-ray bursts.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions whether Amaterasu, noted as a gamma ray, can be compared to GRB221009A, which is a gamma-ray burst, and wonders if Amaterasu refers to a single detected gamma ray.
  • Another participant mentions uncertainty regarding the total energy of GRB221009A, noting it lasted several minutes and had over 5,000 high-energy photons detected.
  • A later reply clarifies that Amaterasu is not a gamma ray burst but rather a single high-energy cosmic ray, possibly a proton, and contrasts it with the energetic collapse of a star represented by GRB221009A.
  • One participant emphasizes that the terminology used, such as "cute names," detracts from scientific credibility and suggests using more precise terms like ultra-high energy cosmic rays.
  • Concerns are raised about the accuracy of energy measurements at high energies due to potential statistical fluctuations and lack of independent calibration.
  • It is noted that primary cosmic rays are not photons but rather protons or nuclei, and that charged particles can bend in magnetic fields, complicating the determination of their source direction.
  • Discussion includes the poorly understood acceleration processes for ultra-high energy cosmic rays, suggesting they may be easier to accelerate if they are fully-stripped nuclei, such as iron, without implying a relationship with GRBs.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the classification and comparison of Amaterasu and GRB221009A. There is no consensus on whether they can be directly compared, and multiple perspectives on their nature and implications are presented.

Contextual Notes

Participants acknowledge limitations in understanding the acceleration mechanisms for cosmic rays and the challenges in measuring energies accurately at high levels. There are also unresolved questions regarding the origins and classifications of the particles discussed.

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TL;DR
Can this "Amaterasu" particle and GRB221009A be compared against each other? The former is always noted as a gamma ray (singular), nowhere have I read it being referred to as a gammy-ray burst, however.
Can this Amaterasu particle and GRB221009A be compared against each other? The former is always noted as a gamma ray (singular), nowhere have I read it being referred to as a gammy-ray burst, however. Does this mean scientists have detected this one lone gamma ray and only one?

[Edit/Update: I just reread an article and noticed it said "cosmic" ray, not "gamma" ray. So I guess this nullifies my questions posted?]

They say that Amaterasu gave off energy equaling 244 exa-electron volts. Doesn't that beat out GRB221009A, which was about 18 tera-electron volts? Please correct my misunderstood interpretation.
 
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I'm not sure what the total energy of GRB221009A ended up being, as it was a gamma ray burst lasting several minutes at its peak with over 5,000 high energy photons detected. So it could go either way I suppose.
 
paulalex7000 said:
TL;DR Summary: Can this "Amaterasu" particle and GRB221009A be compared against each other? The former is always noted as a gamma ray (singular), nowhere have I read it being referred to as a gammy-ray burst, however.

Can this Amaterasu particle and GRB221009A be compared against each other? The former is always noted as a gamma ray (singular), nowhere have I read it being referred to as a gammy-ray burst, however. Does this mean scientists have detected this one lone gamma ray and only one?

[Edit/Update: I just reread an article and noticed it said "cosmic" ray, not "gamma" ray. So I guess this nullifies my questions posted?]

They say that Amaterasu gave off energy equaling 244 exa-electron volts. Doesn't that beat out GRB221009A, which was about 18 tera-electron volts? Please correct my misunderstood interpretation.

The Amaterasu cosmic ray was not a gamma ray burst or even a gamma ray at all. It was an extremely high energy single particle of origin unknown. Maybe a proton.

The GRB221009 event was an extremely energetic collapse of a star.
 
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Using cutsie-poo names is unnecessary, and does not add to one's credibility. Science popularizers and university press offices might not know any better, but we should. We can just call them ultra-high energy cosmic rays.

Some facts:
1. It is known that these are extremely energetic. Are the energy measurements accurate at these energies? Hard to tell. You don't have an independent calibration, and you are plagued by statistical fluctuations.
2. Primary cosmic rays are not photons/gamma rays. They are protons or nuclei.
3. Charged particles bend in magnetic fields: the directiopn where the particle appears to come from is not the direction of the source.
4. The acceleration process for ultra-high energy cosmic rays is poorly understood. It is likely electromagnetic. Thus, it may be easier to accelerate these particles if they are fully-stripped nuclei, such as iron.None of these suggest a relationship with any GRB.
 
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I guess that's on me... I'm not part of any academia, just a layperson who has an interest in cosmology, but from a civilian viewpoint.
 
paulalex7000 said:
I guess that's on me... I'm not part of any academia, just a layperson who has an interest in cosmology, but from a civilian viewpoint.
No fault on you. We're just quite... thorough... around these parts. :wink:
 
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