Any good way to determine coplanarity among 4 points?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around determining coplanarity among four points based on 2D image data. Participants explore methods for assessing coplanarity without 3D information, focusing on the implications of working with 2D representations of scenes.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests using the scalar triple product in 3D to determine coplanarity, but this is not applicable in 2D.
  • Another participant questions the concept of coplanarity in 2D, arguing that without 3D information, determining 3D properties is impossible.
  • A participant clarifies their problem involves classifying points on a ground plane in a 2D image and seeks a method to determine if these points lie on the same plane.
  • Some participants assert that with only 2D data, depth perception is lacking, making it impossible to determine coplanarity.
  • One participant mentions the need for a homography matrix to classify ground and non-ground pixels, indicating a specific application for the discussion.
  • Suggestions are made to use two cameras for depth perception, but constraints of using a single camera are acknowledged.
  • Links to external resources are shared for further reading on related concepts, including homography and depth perception.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree that determining coplanarity with only 2D information is problematic, and multiple competing views remain regarding potential methods and the feasibility of the task.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include the absence of depth information in 2D images, which restricts the ability to assess 3D properties and coplanarity. The discussion also highlights the challenges of working with a single camera setup.

MRT
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Hi,

Can someone suggest a method? I need to implement it on computer.

Thanks in advance!
 
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Choose one point as an origin. Form three displacement vectors from that point. Calculate the scalar triple product (the determinant in 3d). Coplanar if zero.
 
Hi robphy,
thanks for ur help. But the problem is that I'm working with 2-d images. So there is no 3D information.

is there any other way of determining coplanarity?
I read something about using invariants but i have great difficulty understanding the paper. The link is here below:
http://www-users.cs.york.ac.uk/~nep/research/iros01.pdf
under section 2.2.

If someone can explain to me how to determine the point k, j, i,l in that section, i will really appreciate your help.

Thanks in advance!
 
Last edited by a moderator:
MRT said:
Hi robphy,
thanks for ur help. But the problem is that I'm working with 2-d images. So there is no 3D information.
Perhaps it would help if you would tell us what in the world you mean by "coplanarity" in 2d?? If you have no 3D information then there is no way to determine 3D properties.
 
Sorry for not giving a clear idea of my problem.


The problem is as follows:

I have a 2D image of a scene. I classify the scene as ground plane and non-ground plane. I have 4 points lying on these ground plane. For each point, there will be a value (x, y), with x and y representing its pixel location.

Is there a way to determine if these 4 points lie on the same plane with just this 2-D information?

Thanks in advance again!
 
You can't do that. 2d representations of 3d are missing information - specifically the "z" coordinate, if you chose {x,y,z} for your system.

You're obviously writing graphics code. Rather than stating it the way you did, what are you really trying to do? ie., what is your goal?
 
I'm actually trying to find the homography matrix H for the ground plane. I need this matrix H to classify non-ground and ground pixels. The eventual goal is to build a navigation map based on camera capture of the surrounding environment.
:smile:
 
Last edited:
I suggest using two cameras at two locations to provide two images of the same scene.
 
sorry. i forgot one more constraint. I'm working with only one camera. :)
 
  • #10
Then you don't have any depth perception.
 
  • #11
MRT said:
sorry. i forgot one more constraint. I'm working with only one camera. :)

Can you take two pictures with the same camera from two different points? Otherwise, unless you have objects of known size, position and orientation in your single picture, you are out of luck! :)
 

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