Are Heroin Overdoses Increasing in Maine Due to Cheaper Prices?

[Astronuc]

This post has the most amount of stereotyping I've ever seen in a single post on this forum, just full of opinionated non-sense.

lol "Even dope heads know how to stretch a buck."

what's your problem with "dope heads"?

I do have a problem with guys (addicts) who pimp their wives, or parents (addicts) who pimp (sell) their kids, for money to buy drugs.

 

[fras]

Just wanted to share a story of how drug abuse can lead to horrible acts.

http://au.news.yahoo.com/world/a/20619030/mum-raped-her-own-children-while-others-watched/

Webb denied committing any rapes, but reportedly told authorities that she used methamphetamines, and would sometimes trade food stamps for the drug.

Someone addicted to a drug is dangerous from what I've seen, and the stories I've heard from other people.

However, will legalizing and regulation help? Like someone mentioned before the street value price will always beat out the market price.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/jacobsu...-more-than-black-market-pot-for-now-at-least/

http://reason.com/blog/2013/11/06/voters-make-marijuana-colorados-most-hea

 

[StrayCatalyst]

I've driven a cab in a large city - I was pretty familiar with junkies. They're human, but their addiction becomes the most important thing - it eclipses all else, in all too many cases.

I had people offer me sex, for enough money to buy a rock. I've had people try to rob me for the same amount of money. I've even had junkies who thought they could convince me to help beat up pushers to rob them!

Imprisoning junkies is harsh, and doesn't help in the long term unless there's treatment in addition to incarceration. Treatment can only work if they want to be clean more than they want the next fix - visit an NA meeting in your area and you'll meet many, some of whom have been clean for decades but still go to treatment to stay clean.

No, they aren't disposable people - but the addiction is often a stronger motivator than anything else, so they're people who are sometimes unable to do anything that isn't supporting their addictions. Theft, prostitution, identity theft, welfare fraud, etc - are just ways to have money for the next fix.

 

[nitsuj]

Nitsuj, apparently you do not actually have close friends or family addicted to heroin or meth. so please refrain from telling people that have dealt with it how they should feel and act.

Evo, I didn't even remotely tell anyone how to feel or act. Don't put your made up interpretation on me.

I said more less, I found it odd that just as the addiction over took a person so too the brother only saw the addiction. You're absolutely right, I've had the pleasure of never knowing such an addict. Which is why my comment read the way it did..."I find it odd that..."

Just as I wouldn't place holistic blame on a mentally ill person who is rude in public, I wouldn't attribute all actions of an addict as being made clearly & thoughtfully, they're "ill".

 

[nitsuj]

I do have a problem with guys (addicts) who pimp their wives, or parents (addicts) who pimp (sell) their kids, for money to buy drugs.

Surely it's not specifically that the money is spent on drugs that upsets you, unless you're suggesting it's okay to do that if the money is spent on a telescope or new car.

 

[Evo]

Evo, I didn't even remotely tell anyone how to feel or act. Don't put your made up interpretation on me.

I'm referring to all of your posts in this thread.

 

[nitsuj]

I'm referring to all of your posts in this thread.

I just read them and still not sure...but anyways I hope you can see the irony in you feeling I'm telling people how to feel about addicts since I have never been friends with one and how that would mean I'm not "qualified" to post my point of view in a physics forum thread on the topic.

Evo have you ever been a heroin or meth addict?

Very sad that they can't help themselves and many do not want help. They prefer being stoned. Of all of the heroine addicts I've known only one kicked it and stayed clean, the others od'd or wound up in prison.

you've heard of methadone being used to kick a heroin addiction right? Perhaps you believe they are addicted to being stoned...lol qualified.

 

[Evo]

you've heard of methadone being used to kick a heroin addiction right? Perhaps you believe they are addicted to being stoned...lol qualified.

You just do not have any idea what you are talking about, you appear to just be throwing out whatever pops into your head, you do this often.

Since you have no experience with actual addicts, then I suggest that you do some reading and educate yourself before posting, you are detracting from the discussion in this thread.

It is relatively common for MMT patients to continue using heroin, other drugs such as cocaine or marijuana, and alcohol after admission to treatment. This reflects the long history of use, the complexity of patients’ situations and reasons for using drugs, and the biological basis of addiction. Many patients in treatment do not have complete control over their addictions at all times.

http://www.cdc.gov/idu/facts/methadonefin.pdf

 

[nitsuj]

You just do not have any idea what you are talking about, you appear to just be throwing out whatever pops into your head, you do this often.

Evo I'm not sure what makes you feel you have the right to make those assertions, or those below regarding heroin addicts;

Very sad that they can't help themselves and many do not want help. They prefer being stoned.

again, there is a huge difference between "I've been friends with heroin addicts." and having been one or working with them on a daily basis in a recovery context.

I've read enough and watched enough about addiction, and in this case specifically heroin (triggered by Canada's willingness for injection sites) to be able to say the addict is NOT the addiction.

You however are saying they are the addiction. That's your opinion and that's fine. No need to take it to the point of slandering me as someone who is "throwing out whatever pops into your head" and that I do this often.

nice linky, but am unsure what your point is with it.

but I do like how the quote you posted says this blurp

"biological basis of addiction" An addiction which of course you "wrote off" as "Prefer being stoned". Sure Evo, heroin addiction is a preference.

 

[nsaspook]

Just as I wouldn't place holistic blame on a mentally ill person who is rude in public, I wouldn't attribute all actions of an addict as being made clearly & thoughtfully, they're "ill".

I did see it as an illness but even the mental illness of a person is not an excuse to let them ruin the innocent lives of family. If you love someone you come to realization that love won't save them after several calls from an ER room or the police if they don't love themselves or life more than the drug. Heroin addiction is a surrender to death long before your time and I saw little that was clear or thoughtful other than the desire for a high. The "basis of addiction" was irrelevant to me, all I saw was the harm it caused and the need to stop it.

 

[Evo]

"biological basis of addiction"[/I] An addiction which of course you "wrote off" as "Prefer being stoned". Sure Evo, heroin addiction is a preference.

Yes, many prefer being stoned as they will get help, get better, then go right back because they "prefer being stoned", which you don't understand because you haven't lived around these people. They know what it is doing to them and those around them, but it was actually an ex boyfriend that told me the reason he couldn't stay clean was because he "preferred being stoned".

BTW, I was around many of these people daily as they destroyed their lives. I held them as they shook violently, vomited, passed out.

You however are saying they are the addiction.

I said no such thing and don't even know what you mean, but you have been putting words into the mouths of a number of members, you need to stop.

 

[nitsuj]

I did see it as an illness but even the mental illness of a person is not an excuse to let them ruin the innocent lives of family. If you love someone you come to realization that love won't save them after several calls from an ER room or the police if they don't love themselves or life more than the drug. Heroin addiction is a surrender to death long before your time and I saw little that was clear or thoughtful other than the desire for a high.

I couldn't imagine what it's like to try so hard to "reach" a loved one to literally save their life and only have it thrown back at you. I agree completely heroin is just awful and sucks the life out of the user when abused. Heroin in particular. I also can't imagine how a desire for a drug could be stronger then that for sex, food, love, socializing ect. A hellish confinement.

Not sure I agree with the wording that it's a desire for a high, as much as it is a desire for the heroin itself and the chemical re-balance it offers the addict. Surely if a heroin addict seeking treatment was offered a pill that forever removed their addiction and opportunity to ever feel the high from heroin they'd take it...when offered on a "good day".

 

[nitsuj]

Yes, many prefer being stoned as they will get help, get better, then go right back because they "prefer being stoned", which you don't understand because you haven't lived around these people. They know what it is doing to them and those around them, but it was actually an ex boyfriend that told me the reason he couldn't stay clean was because he "preferred being stoned".

Not to be too funny, but Dr. Phil says that'd be the addiction talking.

Would you be happier if I found something written by someone who is "qualified" that claims that once an addict always an addict? Would a "former" heroin addict suffice?

Evo, something tells me if heroin didn't exist that person would still have a preference for the "feel good" easy street that drugs provide, that said I've never been a heroin addict who stopped using; and lean more towards the thinking once an addict always an addict. None the less Evo that's your experience and choice to take his actions as being made clearly and thoughtfully, free of any coercion from past experience.

 

[russ_watters]

Ultimately, "preferring to be stoned" just means being addicted and the root cause (chemical or psychological) doesn't matter much because it has little impact on the problem. You can have sympathy for an addict but still decide they need to be excluded from your life. That decision is based on the external realities of the effects of the addition, not the internal cause.

 

[nitsuj]

I said no such thing and don't even know what you mean, but you have been putting words into the mouths of a number of members, you need to stop.

Didn't say you said it Evo, said "you are saying." If you want I can go on to explain the grammatical difference between the two.

Anyways Evo I see I'm upsetting you posting in your "sandbox". I'll leave it be.

 

[Evo]

Didn't say you said it Evo, said "you are saying." If you want I can go on to explain the grammatical difference between the two.

Anyways Evo I see I'm upsetting you posting in your "sandbox". I'll leave it be.

Thank you. You should try to be more considerate of those that have experienced dealing with an addict first hand, you are entitled to your opinion, but listen to what people that have dealt with it are saying, ok? Your flippant attitude isn't helping your case. Some of the people that have posted have suffered a lot.

 

[klimatos]

Is paying for them to be in jail cheaper then paying for them to be in rehab?

Unfortunately, putting them into rehab does not keep them out of jail. If it did, I would agree with the value of rehab.

 

[nsaspook]

I don't think all current or former heroin addicts are devils (Russell Brand is just an idiot IMO) but most started taking heroin by choice knowing it's deadly addictive and loved that drugged up feeling until they were hooked. The rates of death from overdose from all drugs is now greater than traffic accidents or gun deaths in the US. I've seen data of more than 16,000 overdose deaths just from prescription opioids each year.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-26067987

 

[Astronuc]

"The death of actor Philip Seymour Hoffman has brought new attention to the resurgence of heroin in America and the potentially disastrous effects of substance abuse."

http://billmoyers.com/2014/02/07/the-many-faces-of-addiction/

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/02/04/nyregion/hoffmans-heroin-points-to-surge-in-grim-trade.html

http://www.theatlantic.com/health/a...terrible-heroin-deaths-in-the-shadows/283533/

Moyers: Portrait of Addiction
http://billmoyers.com/content/moyers-on-addiction-close-to-home/

Surely it's not specifically that the money is spent on drugs that upsets you, unless you're suggesting it's okay to do that if the money is spent on a telescope or new car.

No, it's the callous and depraved indifference of those who would harm (pimp) their spouses or children for drugs or money to buy drugs. Those spouses and children are not only raped, but they are exposed to a variety of diseases, including AIDS and hepatitis, and in some cases, they may be drugged.

In one case, a guy used to inject (possibly with contaminated syringes) his wife to knock her out, and sell her to other men for their fun. (As far as I know the guy is nearly dead from AIDS and still doing drugs). In another case, a guy injected his daughter while he was high. She died of an overdose, and the father was oblivious to the fact the she had overdosed. She left behind two children who were placed in foster care.

"The fact is, though, that the sufferer must be a willing participant in their own recovery. They must not pick up a drink or drug. Just don’t pick it up — that’s all." ~ Russell Brand. I don't care much for his comedy, but he does seem to have an understanding of addiction and treatment. The addict must want to become well/recovered.


Edit/Update: The most recent federal data show 19,154 opioid drug deaths in 2010, with 3,094 involving heroin and the rest painkillers. . . . . Heroin deaths of teenagers and young adults tripled in the first decade of this century.


Alysa Ivy (21), died of an overdose May 2013. It was one of 7 deaths in 8 months in one small town.

Phil Drewiske, 23, who embraced recovery in prison after five overdoses and a dozen failed treatment programs, said he bore some responsibility for introducing heroin to the town. The son of local insurance agents, he started abusing painkillers stolen from his friend’s grandfather’s medicine cabinet at 13 and discovered heroin at 16, he said, “at a time when people portrayed it as a dirty drug for homeless people.”

He would buy heroin from Mexican dealers in Minneapolis, who gave him a prepaid cellphone and “chirped” him when his order was ready, he said. He then sold it in Hudson to, among others, Ms. Ivy’s boyfriend, “knowing it was going to Alysa” and to “another guy who died here.”

“I was getting heroin for these people, and even if it wasn’t their first time, it was close,” he said. “Being the one who enabled that is pretty humbling. You get a guilty conscience. Even though they made a decision.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/02/11/us/heroins-small-town-toll-and-a-mothers-pain.html

Now after Alysa's death, her mother has befriended Drewiske and some of Alysa's user-friends in order to understand them and their situation.

Alysa's use of heroin began with use of OxyContin following extraction of her wisdom teeth. "An outgoing, free-spirited artist who found Hudson boring after a childhood in the Dallas area, Alysa was seduced by the potent painkiller, developed an addiction and moved on to heroin."

 

[nsaspook]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...fc1-11e3-b8d8-94577ff66b28_story.html?hpid=z2

The likelihood that many prescription-drug abusers will switch to heroin because it is much cheaper is widely accepted among addiction treatment professionals and law enforcement officials.

Justice Department officials reject any direct linkage between the crackdown on prescription drugs and rising heroin use, although it was a Justice Department unit — the National Drug Intelligence Center — that warned that the campaign against illegal use of prescription drugs was fueling heroin use. The center, which closed in 2012, was separate from the unit employing prosecutors and agents who fight drug use.

 

[Mark44]

Didn't know coke was a recreational drug lol

A lot of people would classify it this way.

And I'm pretty suspicious of Freud maybe having tried heroin in some form or another.

I've never read anything about Freud using heroin, but I seem to remember him using cocaine.

Just as I wouldn't place holistic blame on a mentally ill person who is rude in public, I wouldn't attribute all actions of an addict as being made clearly & thoughtfully, they're "ill".

IMHO that's a lame copout, an attempt to establish a moral equivalence between someone with a genuine organic illness, and someone else who consciously made the decision at one time to stick a hypodermic filled with heroin in their arm. No one chooses to become bipolar or to have cystic fibrosis or the like, but they do make the choice to get high. I'm afraid I don't have any sympathy for them.

 

[SteamKing]

Recent article from the AP on current heroin news in the US:

http://www.nola.com/crime/index.ssf/2014/04/snapshot_of_heroin_use_deaths.html#incart_m-rpt-1

Heroin prices down, abuse and ODs up.

 

[lendav_rott]

I shouldn't say it or think it, but I cannot give a rat's behind about the addicts and their ODs. I lost 3 people I knew to drugs, 1 ODed on mdma and is in a mental institution for the rest of his ..no doubt very short life (the drug messed up his head). As far as I'm concerned, I don't want anything to do with drugs or the people that suffer from being addicted. In my eyes, majority of the hardcore junkees are beyond help - if they OD..well, ain't going to bother my sleep. Call me cruel or merciless, sorry folks.

 

[nsaspook]

http://www.app.com/article/20140416/NJNEWS14/304160077/Narcan-heroin-Ocean-County?nclick_check=1

New Jersey has been plagued in recent years by deaths caused by heroin and prescription drugs, and last year Ocean County became ground zero in the Jersey Shore region. Drug overdoses, many of them directly linked to heroin or prescription opiates, killed 112 people, more than double the year before, according to the Ocean County Prosecutor's Office.

So far this year 24 people have died, and 19 of them have been directly linked to heroin, according to the office.

If you know someone close who is using these drugs please have a kit for an emergency.
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=17578955