Atom-Light Interaction: Understanding d.E vs p.A Hamiltonian

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the interaction of atoms with light, specifically focusing on the transformation between the electric dipole Hamiltonian (d.E form) and the momentum-A vector potential Hamiltonian (p.A form). Participants explore the implications of this transformation for calculations involving photon detection signals and the necessity of applying the transformation to the initial state when using the d.E form.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant notes that the electric dipole Hamiltonian is derived from the p.A form Hamiltonian via a time-independent unitary transformation, questioning whether this transformation needs to be applied to the initial state for calculations.
  • Another participant suggests that in the lowest order of field strength, the transformation can be approximated as the identity, implying that the transformation may not be necessary for certain calculations.
  • A further contribution provides a crude estimation to support the claim that the transformation can be approximated as the identity, using typical values for dipole moments and laser intensity to show that the dimensionless parameter is quite small.
  • Subsequent replies express agreement with the estimation, indicating that it sounds reasonable.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on whether the transformation must be applied to the initial state when using the d.E form Hamiltonian. While some suggest it can be approximated as unnecessary in certain conditions, the initial question remains unresolved.

Contextual Notes

The discussion includes assumptions about field strength and the validity of approximations, which may depend on specific conditions not fully explored in the posts.

zxontt
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I am reading Cohen-Tannoudji's Atom photon interactions (2004 version), in the Appendix he explains that for atom-light interaction, the electric dipole Hamiltonian (d.E form) is got from the original, "physical" (in line with his language) p.A form Hamiltonian by a time-independent unitary transformation (eq. (72) of the Appendix at page 635).

Basically, ##H_{d.E}=TH_{p.A}T^{\dagger}##, where ##H_{d.E}## is the Hamiltonian in electric dipole form, while ##H_{p.A}## is the p.A form Hamiltonian, and ##T=\exp[ -\frac{i}{\hbar} \mathbf{d} \cdot \mathbf{A}_{\perp}(0) ]=\exp\{ \sum_j (\lambda_j ^* a_j- \lambda_j a_j^{\dagger}) \}## where ##\lambda_j = \frac{i}{\sqrt{2 \epsilon_0 \hbar \omega_j L^3}}\mathbf{\epsilon}_j \cdot \mathbf{d}##, is the unitary transformation.

Then isn't it that if one wants to make calculations using the electric dipole Hamiltonian, one needs to first carry out the transformation on the initial state? That is, the initial state should be ##T \left | \phi_{ini} \right \rangle ## but not simply ##\left | \phi_{ini} \right \rangle##? where ##\left | \phi_{ini} \right \rangle## is the ("physical") initial state under the p.A representation.

However when he calculates the photondetection signal in Complement ##\textrm{A}_{\textrm{II}}## (more specifically see eq. (22) and texts around it in this Complement), there seems no indication that this transformation is carried out. Also, according to my experience, usually when using the d.E form one does not carry out any such transformation on the state. Do one need to or not need to carry out such transformation on state when using the d.E form Hamiltonian?
 
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I think that in lowest order in the field strength you can replace T by 1.
 
DrDu said:
I think that in lowest order in the field strength you can replace T by 1.
I did a very crude estimation to convince myself of ##d\cdot |A|/\hbar \ll 1## and so that ##T \approx 1##:

I took the dipole moment to be that of a typical atom, approximately ##2 e a_0 \approx 1.6 \times 10^{-29} C \cdot m## (where ##e## is the elementary charge and ##a_0## the bohr radius), and though I am intending this formalism for single optical photon level calculation, I took a quite intense laser intensity for safety, an intensity of ##I= 50 W/ \textrm{cm}^2##, and ##\omega = 0.4 \times 10^{15} \times 2 \pi \, \textrm{Hz}##. Then using the formulas ##I= \frac{c \epsilon_0}{2} |E|^2##, ##|A| \approx |E|/ \omega## where ##c## is the speed of light and ##\epsilon_0## the vacuum permittivity, I end up with the dimensionless number ##d\cdot |A|/\hbar \approx 1.2 \times 10^{-6}##, indeed it is quite small and it should be quite plausible to replace ##T## by 1.

Is this estimation valid?
 
Sounds reasonable.
 
DrDu said:
Sounds reasonable.
Thanks a lot!
 

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