Can a polynomial have an irrational coefficient?

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around whether a polynomial can have irrational coefficients, specifically examining the polynomial y = x^2 + sqrt(5)x + 1. Participants are exploring the definitions and historical context of polynomials, particularly in relation to the nature of coefficients.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants are questioning the validity of polynomials with irrational coefficients and discussing the implications of coefficients being rational or irrational. Some are referencing historical perspectives on the topic and the definitions used in modern mathematics.

Discussion Status

The discussion is active, with various interpretations being explored. Some participants have provided clarifications regarding the definitions of polynomials over different fields, while others express confusion about the expectations set by teachers regarding coefficients.

Contextual Notes

There is mention of the educational context, specifically that this is an Algebra 2 class, and some participants note that the term "polynomial over rationals" has not been introduced in their curriculum. This may influence the understanding of the topic among students.

  • #31
valenumr said:
Why? A quadratic relation has at most two exact solutions. A quadratic function has infinite many "solitions".
And that's off the scale! I have no idea what you are talking about.
 
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  • #32
PeroK said:
And that's off the scale! I have no idea what you are talking about.
I think Valenumr has this notion that a quadratic function is
$$
f(x) = x^2 +2\pi x +1$$
And what you wrote was
$$
x^2 + 2\pi x +1=0$$
And so, he is saying that you can, in some cases get integral coefficients in the second type of formss, but in the first form anything that you will multiply on RHS will get multiplied to f(x) also.

I think we should tell him that we are interested in finding the root of f(x), and hence setting it to zero is the most natural and rational thing to do. The function f(x) does remain as it is, with non integral coefficients but its root may coincide with the one whose coefficients are integral.
 
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  • #33
Hall said:
I think Valenumr has this notion that a quadratic function is
$$
f(x) = x^2 +2\pi x +1$$
And what you wrote was
$$
x^2 + 2\pi x +1=0$$
And so, he is saying that you can, in some cases get integral coefficients in the second type of formss, but in the first form anything that you will multiply on RHS will get multiplied to f(x) also.

I think we should tell him that we are interested in finding the root of f(x), and hence setting it to zero is the most natural and rational thing to do. The function f(x) does remain as it is, with non integral coefficients but its root may coincide with the one whose coefficients are integral.
That might make some sense.

##f(x) = 0## iff ##kf(x) = 0## where ##k \ne 0##. So, the roots of a function are not changed if you multiply by a non-zero constant.
 
  • #34
valenumr said:
And sorry, I'm using the wrong terminology. I should say equality, not relation.
Not sure what you mean . Do you mean ##\{p(x) \}## is an infinite set for nonconstant polynomials?
 
  • #35
The teacher had maybe some confused memory of term and concept "algebraic number"?

"An algebraic number is a number that is a root of a non-zero polynomial in one variable with integer (or, equivalently, rational) coefficients." (Wiki).
 
  • #36
FactChecker said:
In general, given a field, ##F##, you can talk about "polynomials over the field ##F##" when the coefficients are required to be in the field ##F##
The integers are not a field. But the integers are a ring, and you can talk about polynomials over any ring. If you don't know which ring from context, it is a good idea to ask. One reason teachers ask questions like the OP's is to find out whether you know which ring.
 
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  • #37
Prof B said:
The integers are not a field. But the integers are a ring, and you can talk about polynomials over any ring. If you don't know which ring from context, it is a good idea to ask. One reason teachers ask questions like the OP's is to find out whether you know which ring.
Good point. I stand corrected.
 
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