Can there be anything outside of our Existance?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the concept of existence in relation to the universe, exploring whether anything can exist outside of it. Participants delve into definitions of the universe, the implications of existence, and the nature of boundaries, looping, or infinitude of the universe.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Exploratory

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants suggest that without space and time, nothing can exist outside the universe, raising questions about the implications of such a statement.
  • Others argue that by definition, the universe encompasses all that exists, implying there cannot be anything outside of it.
  • A few participants propose that the universe may be infinite or looped, but this remains uncertain.
  • There is a discussion about the definition of 'universe,' with some noting that it has evolved to mean 'observable space/time' in recent decades.
  • Some contributions explore the idea of nothingness and its characteristics, suggesting that if one were to leave existence, it would still be everywhere.
  • One participant introduces a theory regarding black holes and their role in the creation and restoration of matter, questioning the nature of black holes and their expansion.
  • Another participant challenges the relevance of certain examples and asserts that nothing can travel faster than the speed of light.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the nature of existence outside the universe, with multiple competing views and definitions being presented throughout the discussion.

Contextual Notes

There are limitations in the definitions used by participants, and the discussion reflects a range of existential and ontological perspectives that are not fully resolved.

Blahness
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We exist in the universe, with space and time.

Without space and time, there would be no motion.

If there is no space and time outside of the limits of the WHOLE(not just visible) universe, is it possible to have anything existent outside of the universe?

If nothing can exist outside of the universe, does that mean there is nothing outside?

Implication of last question: Is there an outside, or is our universe infinite/looped? Because how can anything be existent when there is no time to start it?
 
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By definition, nothing can be outside of existence because it doesn't exist.
 
So the universe would be everywhere/infinite/looped... right?
 
The universe is, by definition, everything that exists. So there isn't anything outside of it, by definition. Wether it loops or is infinite is not presently known.
 
Proposing a definition for the term 'universe' is the foremost challenge.
 
So what would the definition of the outside of existence be? x.x

EDIT: You mean OUR existence, right?

so now it's just a choice of finding out if the universe loops or not?

And if we were to leave existence, wouldn't existence be everywhere?
 
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So what would the definition of the outside of existence be?

You can't go outside of existence because anywhere you could possibly BE is part of existence, by definition. You could call it nothingness, I suppose, seeing how you can't say anything about it, in other words it has no characteristics.

And if we were to leave existence, wouldn't existence be everywhere?

Your sentence doesn't make sense. Also, existence IS everywhere, by definition.

Look, I don't know what you're trying to get at here. You can't learn or develop anything by just playing around with words.

Also, I think this thread should be moved to metaphysics.
 
are we talking about fundamentals? or just concepts.
 
concept of leaving the universe.

If the universe IS all of existence, then there is no outside.

So therefore, the universe is everything, which means that its size cannot be limited, or there would be a border between everything and nothing.

How could you have a nothingness border? x.x

And yes, maybe I did post this in the wrong area.
 
  • #10
the definition of universe was once 'all existence' but since about 30-40 years ago the word means 'observable space/time' and the notion of universes within a multiverse has become the standard meaning

it's rather a simplistic view- there are to many existential/ontological hierarchies to pin down the term 'universe'-

you have:

-hubble volume contained within the
-whole of 4D spacetime which is one state/history of the
-Hilbert Space for 4D spacetimes [or a classical multiverse/landscape] which is an infinitessimal portion of the
-infinite dimensional phase space of possible physical systems [Existence]

Universe can be used to describe any of these- and often is without the user explaining which definition they are using!
 
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  • #11
which means that its size cannot be limited

No. It can loop or just have a normal boundary. For example, the universe expands faster than the speed of light, so therefore it has a boundary but you can never reach it.
 
  • #12
all your theories seem possible i believe yall should come together as one and root out every possibility and find the most logical resonable answer on how the universe runs and time itself, truthfully i see our world Earth as just a sort of antfarm,human beings are bored that's why therefore they create and live,where more of a creature who struggles to reach perfection before death takes us, after all we are born to die,the universe itself may be one of many universes for all we know,appart of something to a greater equation.
 
  • #13
heres another theroy about nothing you cannot break matter into notting, for example take a black hole that sucks up a few planets at once where would that matter go to? i believe it just reduces it into atoms that cannot be seen,and therefore the atoms once broken apart drift around to build up and create bigger parts of matter such as stars planets and such i believe black holes are a natural way of restoring and creating new galaxies sort of like natures vaccume,but this is one of my questions even i don't know about why do these black holes expand as more matter is sucked into them if one of yall know could yall please tell me.
 
  • #14
Entropy said:
No. It can loop or just have a normal boundary. For example, the universe expands faster than the speed of light, so therefore it has a boundary but you can never reach it.

I don't understand the relevance of your example, especially because nothing travels faster than the speed of light.
 
  • #15
Check the dates DM, Entropy posted that in 2005. There is a reason threadcromancy is generally frowned upon!
 
  • #16
This question can be best answered by a quote from Hawking, who said that such a question is like asking what's north of the north pole. It doesn't make any sense.
 

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