Can't understand a proof in Rudin

  • Context: Graduate 
  • Thread starter Thread starter kostas230
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Proof
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around understanding a proof from Rudin's text regarding the closure of a set in a metric space. Participants are examining the proof of Theorem 2.27, specifically part (a), which states that the closure of a subspace is a closed set. The focus is on the conditions under which a point not in the closure can have a neighborhood disjoint from the set and its limit points.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions how to prove that there exists a neighborhood around a point not in the closure that does not contain any limit points of the set.
  • Another participant suggests that if every open ball around the point contains a limit point of the set, then the point itself would be a limit point, implying a contradiction.
  • A different participant proposes an alternative proof involving limit points of the limit points, suggesting that if a point is a limit point of the limit points, it must also be a limit point of the original set.
  • One participant acknowledges the alternative proof but notes that it is more technical than their initial approach.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the proof's clarity and the methods used to establish the properties of limit points. There is no consensus on the best approach to proving the claims made in the original proof.

Contextual Notes

Some assumptions about the definitions of neighborhoods and limit points may not be fully clarified. The discussion also reflects varying levels of familiarity with rigorous mathematical concepts among participants.

Who May Find This Useful

Readers interested in metric spaces, closure properties, and the nuances of proofs in real analysis may find this discussion beneficial.

kostas230
Messages
96
Reaction score
3
I can't understand a proof in the Theorem 2.27, part (a).

If X is a metric space, E a subspace of X, and E' the set of all limit points of E, we denote by \bar{E} the set: \bar{E}=E \cup E'

We need to prove that \bar{E} is a closed set. Rudin's proof is this:

If x\in X and x \notin \bar{E} then p is neither a point of E nor a limit point. Hence, p has a neighborhood which does not intersect E. Therefore, the complement of \bar{E} is closed.

My question is this: How do we prove that there exists a neighborhood that does not contain any limit points of E?
 
Last edited:
Physics news on Phys.org
If every open ball at x contains a limit point of E, x would be a limit point of those limit points. Can you prove that it is contradictory for an open ball at x to be disjoint from E?

Edit: I changed "neighborhood" to "open ball", I think neighborhood is wrong although Rudin may define it differently.
 
I found a more straightforward proof. Suppose p is a limit point of E'. Then, for every neighborhood N_r (p) there exists a limit point q of E. There exists a real number h>0 with d(p,q)=r-h. Consider the neighborhood N_h (q)

d(s,p) \leqslant d(p,q)+d(q,s) < r

Hence, s\in N_r (p). Therefore, p is a limit point of E.
Did I get it right? xD
(BTW, I should mention that I'm a physics undergrad; no training in rigorous math except a linear algebra self study with Axler. So, I'm a little slow in this. xD)
 
Last edited:
That works. It is more technical than what I was alluding to above but it's fine.

You should probably mention that s is a point in E.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: 1 person

Similar threads

  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
3K
  • · Replies 15 ·
Replies
15
Views
3K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
3K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
3K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
3K
  • · Replies 11 ·
Replies
11
Views
4K
  • · Replies 0 ·
Replies
0
Views
2K