Comparing Silver and Gold Melting Points: Understanding Coefficient C/G °C

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the melting points of silver and gold, specifically examining how the coefficients of specific heat capacity influence which metal melts first under different heating conditions. It explores theoretical and practical implications of heating metals to their melting points.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Technical explanation, Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants note that silver has a lower melting point (961.8 °C) compared to gold (1064 °C), suggesting that silver would melt first under certain conditions.
  • Others argue that the definition of "melts first" is crucial, as it may depend on the heating method and the context of the experiment.
  • One participant emphasizes that if heat is added at a constant rate, the heat of fusion and initial temperatures must be considered to determine which metal melts first.
  • Another participant points out that factors such as sample size and heat transfer rates also affect the melting process, indicating that the melting sequence is not straightforward.
  • A participant calculates the energy required to reach the melting points of both metals, concluding that while silver melts at a lower temperature, it requires more energy to reach that point when starting from room temperature.
  • It is suggested that if both metals are heated together in an oven, silver would melt first, but if heated separately with constant power, gold would melt first due to its lower energy requirement.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the conditions under which each metal would melt first, indicating that there is no consensus on a definitive answer. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the implications of heating methods on melting order.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight the importance of specific conditions such as heating rates, sample sizes, and definitions of melting, which may influence the outcomes of their claims.

natureboy
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So melting point of silver followed by coefficient c/g °c;
961.8
.056
Now golds;
1064
.031
Does that mean the silver melts first?
 
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It depends on your meaning of "first."

If you are raising T slowly so that both materials stay in near equilibrium with their surroundings, silver will melt first.

If one is adding heat at a constant rate, then one needs the heat of fusion and the initial temperature and masses to determine which would melt first.
 
No, it doesn't. It may, but it depends on other parameters. The size of the two samples, the rates of heat transfer into and out of the two samples.
And also, on what do you mean by "melts first". It is completely liquid or just "starting to melt".
 
natureboy said:
So melting point of silver followed by coefficient c/g °c;
961.8
.056
Now golds;
1064
.031

The figures with units c/g °c are for the specific heat capacity.

If you started with 1gram of both at room temperature (20c) and heated both samples it you would find it would take a different amount of energy for each one to reach melting point. For example it would take..

For silver... E = 1 * (961-20) * 0.056 = 53 calories
For gold... E = 1 * (1064-20) * 0.031 = 32 calories

So although silver has a lower melting point it takes more heat to get there.

So the answer depends on how the samples are heated as Dr Courtney said. If they are put in an oven together and the temperature increased slowly then Silver melts first. If you heat each one separately using something like a constant power electrical heater then gold melts first because it takes less energy.
 
Thanks exactly what i was asking couldn't word it for the life of me though haha much appreciated
 

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