Dealing with Demanding Employers: A Programmer's Perspective

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the challenges faced by programmers in demanding work environments, particularly regarding unclear expectations, communication issues, and the nature of employer-employee relationships. Participants share personal experiences and perspectives on how to navigate these situations, highlighting both technical and interpersonal aspects.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant describes their experience with an employer who has unclear working hours and demands late-night availability, expressing frustration and confusion about how to address the situation.
  • Another participant shares a similar experience with an erratic employer, suggesting that such behavior may indicate deeper issues and advising caution.
  • A different contributor recounts a past experience with a charismatic but dishonest employer, emphasizing the importance of understanding the terms of employment and the potential for exploitation.
  • Some participants propose that miscommunication may be at the heart of these issues, advocating for clear agreements on work expectations and hours before starting a job.
  • One participant raises the question of whether the employment arrangement is salaried or hourly, noting that salaried positions often come with different expectations regarding availability.
  • Another participant expresses concern that the original poster may not recognize their mistreatment, suggesting that such experiences could be more common than they realize.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the nature of the issues discussed. While some suggest that miscommunication is a key factor, others emphasize the potential for exploitative behavior by employers. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the best approach to handle such situations.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include the lack of clarity on specific employment agreements, the subjective nature of experiences shared, and the varying expectations of different employers in academic and technical fields.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be useful for new programmers, students entering the job market, and individuals navigating challenging employer relationships in technical fields.

rootX
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I worked for him for 4 months during summers and will be working for this term too as a programmer. He always little demanding but I guess all employer are like that. He has my msn and he doesn't clearly define my working hours and msn anytime even late at night (1 AM once.. 10-11 PM often even when I work over +8 sometimes that day but never get paid for additional hours)...

I worked good last term and he rehired me. For this term, I needed a mac for programming and he looks pretty insincere in my opinion as following conversation suggests and pretends as if he is doing me a favor giving me a job:

12/22/2008
Mac.. i will be picking up on Wednesday..
couldn't meet him last week end because of the snow.

12/24/2008
actually i just got off the phone with him..
we are meeting Sunday morning 10 AM..
maybe you can come in later that afternoon..
worst case, i will drop it off at your place after meeting him..

12/28/2008
He forgot to get the laptop :( i am picking
it up from him tomorrow morning on my way to work...
i will drop it off at your place on my way back tomorrow evening..

12/29/2008
is it possible for you to come home around 8 to pick up the laptop?

<Received incompatible laptop>

12/29/2008
if you are going to get it tomorrow from bestbuy,
then i won't come to your place tomorrow to give my Mac.. [which I can use for next 5 days only]

12/30/2008
ok.. let me know.. i am home for the next 5 days...
if you want to pick up my Mac Book.. you can anytime...


I am really confused about how to approach this situation but it's getting very frustrating. I am a beginner, so I guess I don't have enough say ...
 
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I once worked for a guy and found myself in a similar situation. I was a senior in college and this guy hired me to help him build lasers and make a library for spectroscopy applications. One day, I told him i needed parts (transistors and such) and he kept stalling me, as if he expected me to just supply my own parts. Eventually his behavior became very erratic and i came to the conclusion that he was a bit eccentric. urgent Email correspondence at 3 am and short notice project were just unreasonable to me. He stopped shaving and started to never leave his lab. It was like watching a man's slow decent into insanity. I quit.

Your boss may not be crazy, but i would probably start watching for signs.
 
I entered into a contractor/subcontractor agreement writing application programs in dBase III+, and compiling them with Foxbase (eventually). I was making the guy tons of money with billable hours, and I ended up having to chase him via phone, etc to get paid. He was a charismatic guy and he at least pretended to be a Christian (his brother was an evangelical minister in my town), but he was a con-man through and through. He gave lots of tough programming jobs to his cousin, then farmed them off onto me when his cousin screwed them up. Needless to say, customers were NOT happy being charged for my quick and reasonable wages making their programs AND the wasted hours his idiot cousin charged against them before I took over his projects.
 
A lot of these issues sound like miscommunications between employer and employee.

First of all when you agree to work for someone, you need to make sure of what you're agreeing to - the hours expected and what work you will be paid for, for example. It's best to get this in writing.

Many professors who hire undergraduate students will likely expect them to put in long hours, similar to graduate students. This is the nature of research. But again, this goes back to the first point - be sure of what you're agreeing to before you make a committment. Being contacted at at 1 am, seems unreasonable to me - but there are some cases (eg. experimental or clinical work) where this kind of thing is necessary.

If you have a disagreement with your employer, be sure to approach him or her in a professional manner. Be sure to explain the issue and document any steps you take to solve it.

Also note that posting MSN conversations on a public forum is generally not a constructive means of resolving a conflict.
 
Choppy said:
If you have a disagreement with your employer, be sure to approach him or her in a professional manner. Be sure to explain the issue and document any steps you take to solve it.

Yes, I think this is a good advice. But currently, I am just a beginner and new to the job market so I never disagreed with employer hoping that he would act fair and rational.

Also note that posting MSN conversations on a public forum is generally not a constructive means of resolving a conflict.

Sorry about that. I used pronouns and selected only few lines for anonymity. Also, I am not even sure that there is a conflict that needs to be resolved because I don't know if I am thinking from the right perspective. My employer's definitely bit eccentric but I don't know if this happens everywhere.

Thanks everyone for the replies :).
 
Are you salaried or hourly?

Salaried employees have a little more expected of them in terms of availability. They do this in exchange for a steady work sitch and a consistent pay cheque.
 
Last edited:
You're being treated like garbage. I was too, years ago. I didn't realize it then, much like you don't realize it now.

Maybe there's a silver lining; maybe it builds character or something. You and I can hope.
 

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