News Delhi gang-rape victim dies in hospital in Singapore

[rootX]

The following article contains disturbing details of the particularly violent attack.
http://news.yahoo.com/indian-students-gang-rape-murder-two-worlds-collide-055603952.html

In wake of this attack, someone on radio was getting into details and I quickly changed the channel because of the disturbing nature of the attack. I continued avoiding the issue until they started focusing on "debate" and future than the actual incident.

I don't understand the need for a debate. Debate what?

From reading surajt post, I feel like people are associating this attack with people behind moral policing attacks (http://articles.timesofindia.indiat...94_1_mangalore-pub-jagadish-karanth-attackers). People want everyone to be more tolerant and liberal IMO.

It's very unclear about what they are going to debate about. There are many broad issues that need to be addressed like:
1) Better security
2) Tolerant to western values
3) Encouraging women to report these incidents
4) Society to be more supportive of victims

 

[jobyts]

A colleague of mine is from Delhi. He once told us an incident happened to one of his neighbors.

In his apartment complex, there was this widow and her 3 teenage sons. One of the sons was stabbed to death by some gang. The family knows who did it. The gang threatened the mom that if she complains to the police they are going to kill her the other two sons.

To protect her other children, till now she has not made any evidence to the police.

 

[rootX]

More, friend's interview:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-india-20916131

It appears the girl was not given attention just moments after the incident neither few days after when her condition was deteriorating. The government could have fly her to western hospital instead of ignoring the incident for first few days and then immaturely flying her to Singapore IMO

In other news,
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-india-20907458

The ruling Congress party in India's Assam state has suspended a politician accused of rape after he was set upon and beaten by crowds in a village.

 

[Evo]

Just appaling.

 

[drizzle]

Oh my.. poor girl :'(

I have no word that can express my grief for her, and anger of such digusting criminals

 

[Reshma]

Truly appalling! I was in Singapore last week on the same day when the victim passed away :-(
Cultural attitudes in India will take time to change but stringent punishments to rapists are certainly the need of the hour. I don't how many more restrictions are to be imposed on women, to "prevent themselves from being raped".

I think it would be more reasonable to restrict men after 9 PM (or whatever magical hour) to make public places safer for women in India.

 

[lisab]

I think it would be more reasonable to restrict men after 9 PM (or whatever magical hour) to make public places safer for women in India.

That's very wise !

 

[surajt88]

That's very wise !

Wise indeed..

 

[jobyts]

The problem with stringent punishments (like death penalty) for rapists is that the chances of the victim getting murdered by the rapist is very high. In India, sometime back when they tried to bring capital punishment for rape crime, women organizations were against it, due to this reason.

 

[Evo]

The problem with stringent punishments (like death penalty) for rapists is that the chances of the victim getting murdered by the rapist is very high. In India, sometime back when they tried to bring capital punishment for rape crime, women organizations were against it, due to this reason.

Make the punishment fit the crime, if the girl is injured, life sentence, if she dies, death penalty, if raped and not hurt, lengthy sentence.

 

[jobyts]

Make the punishment fit the crime, if the girl is injured, life sentence, if she dies, death penalty, if raped and not hurt, lengthy sentence.

That's what the current law is. After the Delhi incident, people were demanding death sentence for rape itself.

 

[lisab]

That's what the current law is. After the Delhi incident, people were demanding death sentence for rape itself.

It's not the severity of punishment but rather the certainty of punishment that deters crime.

-- attributed to Isaac Parker

 

[rootX]

Looking at current situation, it's bit disappointing that it will take years before the individual are given the punishment they deserve.

That's what the current law is. After the Delhi incident, people were demanding death sentence for rape itself.

Should we assume that mentally deranged individuals, under alcohol influence, are really capable of thinking that?

 

[Reshma]

The problem with stringent punishments (like death penalty) for rapists is that the chances of the victim getting murdered by the rapist is very high. In India, sometime back when they tried to bring capital punishment for rape crime, women organizations were against it, due to this reason.

I agree, death penalty itself may not be the best solution to reduce the number of rapes. However, the main reason for the alarmingly high number of rapes in India is the lack of deterrent. The definition of rape in most Indian laws is archaic and punishments for sodomy and other forms of sexual assault are a mere slap in the wrist. Stringent punishments should include (may not be limited to capital punishment) chemical castration, registration of the sex offender etc.

There are a several levels of sexual harassment faced by Indian women in their everyday lives, most of which stem from the patriarchal mindset of most Indians (men and women). A cousin (female) of mine who is fond of sport bikes often tells me about the routine hazing she faces on the highways by male bike riders. She has on occasions reported about them to the traffic police who are mostly callous to her complaints. She now wears a thick jacket and has her hair tucked under her helmet when she rides her bike (so that it isn't obvious she's a female). Similar inconveniences are faced by female car drivers as well. I live in Mumbai which is only slightly safer than the capital, Delhi.

Almost every incident of rape in India no matter how heinous, is somehow convoluted to what the female in question was doing or wearing. Personally, I find it quite suffocating to lead a restrictive life where I have to worry about what I wear, when or with whom I go out with, because I know if something untoward were to happen to me, it is very likely the blame would fall squarely on me.

 

[rootX]

A related news: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-20938125

The death of a student who was gang-raped on a Delhi bus has prompted anguished soul-searching about the place of women in Indian society. The widespread killing of female foetuses and infants is well-documented, but less well-known is the trafficking of girls across the country to make up for the resulting shortages.

 

[drizzle]

Make the punishment fit the crime, if the girl is injured, life sentence, if she dies, death penalty, if raped and not hurt..

Really Evo, not hurt?

lengthy sentence.

I don't find that to be a fair punishment. Not to mention it won't change the criminal's attitude towards rape.

 

[Evo]

Really Evo, not hurt?

This is going by the post that said men in India would kill the woman if they would get the death penalty despite not physically injuring her. The primary concern is for the safety of the rape victim, IMO.

 

[nanosiborg]

[urlThere are many women-issues in that area and I wonder if ever these issues will be addressed adequately as it can be clear from how poorly the Indian government responded ...

It's a cultural (extreme male dominance) as well as economic issue. Lots of really poor people crowded into a relatively small space. No immediate solutions come to mind.

 

[Curious3141]

*Another* one, this time in Punjab. This time she was married, so the perpetrators don't even have their hollow rationalisation of "moral policing". At least, the victim wasn't maimed vengefully this time : http://www.washingtonpost.com/world...bb80b2-5d91-11e2-8acb-ab5cb77e95c8_story.html

Granted, this sort of thing happens the world over, and this case wasn't as horrific as the first, so it ordinarily might not have made the world news. But it looks like the Indian cases are going to keep making international news until the world's collective attention span for lurid crime wears off (and that takes some doing). The only good that can come from the extra scrutiny is that the Indian government will (hopefully) be forced to take some real action to protect women.

 

[jedishrfu]

More sad news: When a guru says the victim could have avoided this tragedy:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...g-rape-victim-could-have-avoided-tragedy.html

 

[Evo]

This rape and murder happened right after.

But even as thousands mourned the rape victim's death and in a sign of how pervasive such crimes are, police in West Bengal state were investigating another suspected gang-rape and death.

In the latest case, the family of a woman said she and her husband were attacked by six men as they returned home after working at a brick factory.

They dragged the woman into a nearby farm after pouring acid into her husband's mouth, the family said.

The woman was found dead with multiple injuries, said police officer Bhaskar Mukherjee, adding he was waiting for an autopsy report.

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-202_162-57561260/india-gang-rape-victims-body-cremated/

 

[surajt88]

*Another* one, this time in Punjab. [as shown in an international media to be of interest to its readers] This time she was married, so the perpetrators don't even have their hollow rationalisation of "moral policing". [as shown in an international media to be of interest to its readers] At least, the victim wasn't maimed vengefully this time : [as shown in an international media to be of interest to its readers] http://www.washingtonpost.com/world...bb80b2-5d91-11e2-8acb-ab5cb77e95c8_story.html

**stuff within [ & ] mine..
see d difference.?

 

[Curious3141]

**stuff within [ & ] mine..
see d difference.?

You're saying that it wouldn't have made the news without the "priming" from the first incident. I could just as easily argue that the fallout from the first incident should've shamed the populace (at least the authorities, if not would-be rapists themselves) into behaving better, if only to salvage India's reputation, which hangs in tatters right now.

"International interest" cuts both ways, you know.

 

[rootX]

African countries are in far worse situation than India. Yet, we see more of Indian rape incidents merely because of media hype. Few months from now, India reputation will be as good as it was before IMO.

Way before this incident, I had pessimistic perspective on these issues (I had started a thread on child marriages etc. on that region a while ago keeping track of all women issues in that region). My views are still the same. There's nothing much that can be done and in few months everyone will forget this and business will be as usual.

 

[surajt88]

You're saying that it wouldn't have made the news without the "priming" from the first incident. I could just as easily argue that the fallout from the first incident should've shamed the populace (at least the authorities, if not would-be rapists themselves) into behaving better, if only to salvage India's reputation, which hangs in tatters right now.

"International interest" cuts both ways, you know.

I never argued that people shouldn't try to better themselves. I agree with you in the sense that Indian policy makers should consider the international coverage this issue had generated and the negative image for India that resulted from this, and these policy makers should strive to make good policies to deter would-be rapists. But in a country of 1.2 Billion people, the first incident and subsequent incident(s) cannot be taken as representing the whole nation just because it made international news, unless a reliable 'rape per 1000 citizens per year' or something similar can be presented to show a problem in the culture. Your comments which essentially says "all Indians" should feel ashamed and "all" of them should "change just because this rape incident made international news" doesn't make sense in this regard because not every Indian guy rapes a girl who is found alone & helpless.

Whichever way it cuts, International reaction = What international media decides its viewers will like. You seem to have taken an interest in this issue, and your interest in this issue was decided by "international media".