Deriving Special Relativity from Particle Indistinguishability

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Discussion Overview

The discussion explores the possibility of deriving special relativity from the principle of indistinguishability of particles in quantum mechanics. It examines the implications of this principle for the laws of physics in different inertial frames, particularly in relation to collisions of particles in varying contexts, such as a moving train versus a laboratory setting.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that if particles of the same type are indistinguishable, then collisions occurring in a train moving at constant speed should yield results equivalent to those in a stationary laboratory, suggesting that the laws of physics are consistent across different frames.
  • Others argue that the indistinguishability of particles does not necessarily lead to the conclusion that the laws of physics must be the same in all inertial frames, asserting that distinguishable particles can also adhere to the same physical laws.
  • A participant questions the connection between indistinguishable particles and the causal structure of Minkowski spacetime, indicating uncertainty about how these concepts are related.
  • Another participant notes that while deriving special relativity from indistinguishability may not be feasible, there is a relationship between special relativity and quantum mechanics through charge-parity-time symmetry.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express disagreement regarding the implications of indistinguishable particles for special relativity, with no consensus reached on whether special relativity can be derived from this principle.

Contextual Notes

The discussion highlights limitations in connecting indistinguishability to the causal structure of spacetime and the implications for physical laws across different frames, without resolving these complexities.

accdd
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Is it possible to derive special relativity from the principle of quantum mechanics according to which particles of the same type are indistinguishable?
For example, if it is not possible to distinguish particles of the same type then particles colliding in a train at constant speed should produce the same result as those colliding in the lab. This would imply that the laws of physics are the same on the train and in the laboratory.
Is that a question that makes sense?
 
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accdd said:
Is it possible to derive special relativity from the principle of quantum mechanics according to which particles of the same type are indistinguishable?
No.
For example, if it is not possible to distinguish particles of the same type then particles colliding in a train at constant speed should produce the same result as those colliding in the lab. This would imply that the laws of physics are the same on the train and in the laboratory.
That does not follow. The laws of physics apply to distinguishable particles just as they do to indistinguishable ones, so they can be the same on the train and in the lab regardless of the distinguishability of the particles.

Note that this notion that the laws of physics are the same in all inertial frames way predates the development of SR.
 
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It’s not at all clear how “indistinguishable particles” implies the causal structure of Minkowski (lorentz-signature) spacetime
(with its finite maximum signal speed).
 
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accdd said:
Is it possible to derive special relativity from the principle of quantum mechanics according to which particles of the same type are indistinguishable?
No, but SR is related to quantum mechanics charge-parity-time symmetry.
 
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