What is the Concise Proof for the Determinant Product Rule?

  • Context: Graduate 
  • Thread starter Thread starter etnad179
  • Start date Start date
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around finding a concise proof for the determinant product rule, specifically the statement that for matrices A and B, det(AB) = det(A)det(B). Participants explore various approaches, including definitions, properties, and mathematical derivations related to determinants.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant recalls having previously known a concise proof for the determinant product rule but has forgotten it.
  • Another participant references the Cauchy-Binet formula as a potential source for the proof.
  • A different approach is suggested using the property that det(A) = exp(Tr(ln(A))).
  • A detailed derivation of the determinant product rule is provided, using the definition of the determinant and involving permutations and sign functions.
  • There is a request for clarification regarding the notation and steps in the provided derivation, specifically about the permutations involved.
  • One participant acknowledges a mistake in their reasoning and seeks to clarify the relationship between the permutations used in the proof.
  • A concise proof is proposed using a coordinate-free definition involving endomorphisms and the action on the exterior power of a vector space.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express various methods and approaches to proving the determinant product rule, with no consensus on a single concise proof. Some participants agree on the validity of certain definitions and properties, while others raise questions and seek clarification on specific steps.

Contextual Notes

Some participants note the complexity of the derivations and the need for careful attention to the definitions and properties of permutations and determinants. There are also indications of potential misunderstandings regarding the notation used in the proofs.

etnad179
Messages
11
Reaction score
0
I used to know how to prove the statement for matrices
det(AB)=det(A)det(B) concisely but for the life of me I've forgotten it...

Does anyone know a concise proof for this?

Thanks!
 
Physics news on Phys.org


Use the fact that

\mbox{det}A = \exp (\mbox{Tr} \ln A)
 


The definition of the determinant is

\det A=\sum_\sigma (\operatorname{sgn}\sigma)A^1_{\sigma(1)}\cdots A^n_{\sigma(n)}

where the sum is over all permutations of the set {1,2,...,n}, sgn σ is =1 when the permutation is even and =-1 when it's odd, and A^i_j denotes the entry on row i, column j. With this notation, you can do it as a fairly straightforward calculation:

<br /> \begin{align*}<br /> \det(AB) &amp;=\sum_\sigma (\operatorname{sgn}\sigma)(AB)^1_{\sigma(1)}\cdots (AB)^n_{\sigma(n)}=\sum_\sigma (\operatorname{sgn}\sigma)\Big(\sum_{i_1}A^1_{i_1}B^{i_1}_{\sigma(1)}\Big)\cdots \Big(\sum_{i_n}A^1_{i_n}B^{i_n}_{\sigma(n)}\Big)\\<br /> &amp;=\sum_{i_1,\dots,i_n}A^1_{i_1}\cdots A^n_{i_n}<br /> \underbrace{\sum_\sigma (\operatorname{sgn}\sigma) B^{i_1}_{\sigma(1)}\cdots B^{i_n}_{\sigma(n)}}_{=0\text{ unless }(i_1,\dots,i_n)\text{ is a permutation of }(1,\dots,n).}\\<br /> &amp;=\sum_\tau A^1_{\tau(1)}\cdots A^n_{\tau(n)}\sum_\sigma (\operatorname{sgn}\sigma) B^{\tau(1)}_{\sigma(1)}\cdots B^{\tau(n)}_{\sigma(n)}\\<br /> &amp;=\sum_\tau A^1_{\tau(1)}\cdots A^n_{\tau(n)}\sum_\sigma \underbrace{(\operatorname{sgn}\sigma)}_{=(\operatorname{sgn}\tau)(\operatorname{sgn}(\tau^{-1}\circ\sigma))} B^{1}_{\tau^{-1}\circ\sigma(1)}\cdots B^{n}_{\tau^{-1}\circ\sigma(n)}\\<br /> &amp;=\sum_\tau(\operatorname{sgn}\tau)A^1_{\tau(1)}\cdots A^n_{\tau(n)}\underbrace{\sum_{\tau^{-1}\circ\sigma}(\operatorname{sgn}(\tau^{-1}\circ\sigma))B^{1}_{\tau^{-1}\circ\sigma(1)}\cdots B^{n}_{\tau^{-1}\circ\sigma(n)}}_{=\det B}\\<br /> &amp;=(\det A)(\det B)<br /> \end{align*}<br />

but you will probably have to stare at this for a while before you understand all the steps.
 


Fredrik said:
The definition of the determinant is

\det A=\sum_\sigma (\operatorname{sgn}\sigma)A^1_{\sigma(1)}\cdots A^n_{\sigma(n)}

where the sum is over all permutations of the set {1,2,...,n}, sgn σ is =1 when the permutation is even and =-1 when it's odd, and A^i_j denotes the entry on row i, column j. With this notation, you can do it as a fairly straightforward calculation:

<br /> \begin{align*}<br /> \det(AB) &amp;=\sum_\sigma (\operatorname{sgn}\sigma)(AB)^1_{\sigma(1)}\cdots (AB)^n_{\sigma(n)}=\sum_\sigma (\operatorname{sgn}\sigma)\Big(\sum_{i_1}A^1_{i_1}B^{i_1}_{\sigma(1)}\Big)\cdots \Big(\sum_{i_n}A^1_{i_n}B^{i_n}_{\sigma(n)}\Big)\\<br /> &amp;=\sum_{i_1,\dots,i_n}A^1_{i_1}\cdots A^n_{i_n}<br /> \underbrace{\sum_\sigma (\operatorname{sgn}\sigma) B^{i_1}_{\sigma(1)}\cdots B^{i_n}_{\sigma(n)}}_{=0\text{ unless }(i_1,\dots,i_n)\text{ is a permutation of }(1,\dots,n).}\\<br /> &amp;=\sum_\tau A^1_{\tau(1)}\cdots A^n_{\tau(n)}\sum_\sigma (\operatorname{sgn}\sigma) B^{\tau(1)}_{\sigma(1)}\cdots B^{\tau(n)}_{\sigma(n)}\\<br /> &amp;=\sum_\tau A^1_{\tau(1)}\cdots A^n_{\tau(n)}\sum_\sigma \underbrace{(\operatorname{sgn}\sigma)}_{=(\operatorname{sgn}\tau)(\operatorname{sgn}(\tau^{-1}\circ\sigma))} B^{1}_{\tau^{-1}\circ\sigma(1)}\cdots B^{n}_{\tau^{-1}\circ\sigma(n)}\\<br /> &amp;=\sum_\tau(\operatorname{sgn}\tau)A^1_{\tau(1)}\cdots A^n_{\tau(n)}\underbrace{\sum_{\tau^{-1}\circ\sigma}(\operatorname{sgn}(\tau^{-1}\circ\sigma))B^{1}_{\tau^{-1}\circ\sigma(1)}\cdots B^{n}_{\tau^{-1}\circ\sigma(n)}}_{=\det B}\\<br /> &amp;=(\det A)(\det B)<br /> \end{align*}<br />

but you will probably have to stare at this for a while before you understand all the steps.




Hi, thanks for the help - I've been looking at this for a bit and I think I understand most of it.

Just to check the \tau is the set of permutation of the elements {i_1,...i_n}? And how can we get from this permutation \tau of the row is equal to the inverse \tau^{-1} of the column for matrix element B^{\tau(1)}_{\sigma(1)}
 


deleted, realized it is wrong and I'm too lazy to correct it.
 
Last edited:


etnad179 said:
Just to check the \tau is the set of permutation of the elements {i_1,...i_n}?
\tau and \sigma are both permutations of {1,2,...,n}, i.e. they are bijections from that set onto itself. In the revised calculation below, \rho represents a permutation of {1,2,...,n} too.

etnad179 said:
And how can we get from this permutation \tau of the row is equal to the inverse \tau^{-1} of the column for matrix element B^{\tau(1)}_{\sigma(1)}
I think I did that step wrong. This is how I would like to handle the product B^{\tau(1)}_{\sigma(1)}\cdots B^{\tau(n)}_{\sigma(n)} today: First use the fact that real numbers commute, to rearrange the factors so that the row indices (the upper indices) appear in the order (1,2,...,n). I'll write asterisks instead of the column indices until we have figured out what we should write in those slots.

B^{\tau(1)}_{\sigma(1)}\cdots B^{\tau(n)}_{\sigma(n)}=B^1_*\cdots B^n_*

Now use the fact that for each k in {1,2,...,n} we have k=\tau(\tau^{-1}(k)), to rewrite this as

=B^{\tau(\tau^{-1}(1))}_*\cdots B^{\tau(\tau^{-1}(n))}_*.

Now just look at the product we started with and note that when the row index is \tau(k), the column index is \sigma(k). This tells us what the column indices are.

=B^{\tau(\tau^{-1}(1))}_{\sigma(\tau^{-1}(1))}\cdots B^{\tau(\tau^{-1}(n))}_{\sigma(\tau^{-1}(n))} =B^{1}_{\sigma(\tau^{-1}(1))}\cdots B^{n}_{\sigma(\tau^{-1}(n))}.

So the calculation should look like this:

<br /> \begin{align*}<br /> \det(AB) &amp;=\sum_\sigma (\operatorname{sgn}\sigma)(AB)^1_{\sigma(1)}\cdots (AB)^n_{\sigma(n)}=\sum_\sigma (\operatorname{sgn}\sigma)\Big(\sum_{i_1}A^1_{i_1} B^{i_1}_{\sigma(1)}\Big)\cdots \Big(\sum_{i_n}A^n_{i_n}B^{i_n}_{\sigma(n)}\Big)\\<br /> &amp;=\sum_{i_1,\dots,i_n}A^1_{i_1}\cdots A^n_{i_n}<br /> \underbrace{\sum_\sigma (\operatorname{sgn}\sigma) B^{i_1}_{\sigma(1)}\cdots B^{i_n}_{\sigma(n)}}_{=0\text{ unless there&#039;s a permutation }\tau\text{ such that }\tau(1,\dots,n)=(i_1,\dots,i_n).}\\<br /> &amp;=\sum_\tau A^1_{\tau(1)}\cdots A^n_{\tau(n)}\sum_\sigma (\operatorname{sgn}\sigma) B^{\tau(1)}_{\sigma(1)}\cdots B^{\tau(n)}_{\sigma(n)}\\<br /> &amp;=\sum_\tau A^1_{\tau(1)}\cdots A^n_{\tau(n)}\sum_\sigma \underbrace{(\operatorname{sgn}\sigma)}_{=(\operatorname{sgn}\tau)(\operatorname{sgn}(\sigma\circ\tau^{-1}))} B^{1}_{\sigma(\tau^{-1}(1))}\cdots B^{n}_{\sigma(\tau^{-1}(n))}\\<br /> &amp;=\sum_\tau(\operatorname{sgn}\tau)A^1_{\tau(1)}\cdots A^n_{\tau(n)}\sum_{\rho}(\operatorname{sgn}\rho)B^{1}_{\rho(1)}\cdots B^{n}_{\rho(n)}\\<br /> &amp;=(\det A)(\det B)<br /> \end{align*}<br />

To understand the step where I introduced the symbol \rho, you just have to stare at those two lines until you see that the sums contain the same terms.
 
Last edited:


The most concise proof is using the most elegant, coordinate free definition. Namely if L is an endomorphism of the n-dimensional vector space V, then the induced map

\hat{A}:\bigwedge^nV\to \bigwedge^nV
is a linear map between 1-dimensional spaces. The scalar by which it acts is the determinant of L, so for \omega\in\bigwedge^nV we have

\hat{A}\omega=\det A\cdot\omega.
Hence
\widehat{AB}\omega=\hat{A}(\det B\cdot\omega)=\det A\det B\cdot\omega.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 20 ·
Replies
20
Views
3K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
3K
  • · Replies 21 ·
Replies
21
Views
2K
  • · Replies 20 ·
Replies
20
Views
3K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
3K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
3K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
3K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
4K
Replies
2
Views
9K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K