Discovering the Significance of the 44th President and Country in the World

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the significance of the term "44th" in relation to President Obama and the ranking of countries. Participants explore how to phrase questions that would lead to the answer "44th," considering various contexts and interpretations.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants suggest various ways to ask questions that would yield "44th" as an answer, such as "Which president is Obama?" or "What number president is Obama?"
  • Others express confusion about the phrasing of questions and the nature of ordinal numbers in English, noting that there may not be a direct way to ask for an ordinal rank.
  • A few participants mention the ambiguity in the phrasing of questions and how it could lead to different interpretations.
  • Some participants reflect on the cultural implications of Obama's presidency and how it has affected perceptions of the United States internationally.
  • There are discussions about the historical context of presidential rankings, including references to Grover Cleveland's unique situation as a two-term president.
  • Participants also explore the idea of using similes and comparisons in framing questions, although some express skepticism about their appropriateness in this context.
  • One participant introduces the term "nth" as a way to refer to ordinal numbers, suggesting it could be a solution to the question posed.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the best way to phrase questions that lead to the answer "44th." There are multiple competing views on the clarity and appropriateness of different question formats.

Contextual Notes

There are limitations in the discussion regarding the assumptions made about language and ordinal numbers, as well as the cultural context surrounding the significance of Obama's presidency.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be of interest to those exploring language, ordinal numbers, cultural perceptions of leadership, and the nuances of phrasing questions in English.

jobyts
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Obama is the 44th President of USA. or,
The country x is the 44th largest in the world.

To get an answer 44th, what's the question to ask?
 
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jobyts said:
Obama is the 44th President of USA. or,
The country x is the 44th largest in the world.

To get an answer 44th, what's the question to ask?

-1- (not sure how to word it...)

-2- What is the rank of country x among all countries in terms of geographical area?
 
russ_watters said:
Chartreuce moose.

Google wants to know if you meant "Chartreuse Moose".
 
I think you would use some sort of simile here. Come to think of that, I discovered you are comparing two different things wrt two separate criteria. Similie looks like only work if you are describing two different things using one same quality or something like that.

ranked as largest as all the US presidents to now.. and this doesn't make any sense to me.
 
jobyts said:
To get an answer 44th, what's the question to ask?

What is half of 22th?
 
jobyts said:
Obama is the 44th President of USA. or,
The country x is the 44th largest in the world.

To get an answer 44th, what's the question to ask?


President Obama is America's -blank- President

or,

This country is the -blank- largest in the world.

sorry if I misunderstood you
 
rootX said:
I think you would use some sort of simile here. Come to think of that, I discovered you are comparing two different things wrt two separate criteria. Similie looks like only work if you are describing two different things using one same quality or something like that.

ranked as largest as all the US presidents to now.. and this doesn't make any sense to me.

May be, I did not explain my question properly in my original post. I'm not trying to combine both the statements with a single question and single answer.

Let's say, the statement is "Obama is the 44th President of USA". How would you ask a question on this, so that the answer is 44th.
 
jobyts said:
Let's say, the statement is "Obama is the 44th President of USA". How would you ask a question on this, so that the answer is 44th.

One way, albeit open to alternate interpretations, would be:

"Which president is Obama?"

The "which" question can be answered with "44th", but is also a bit ambiguous.

Where did this question come from? Is it a class assignment, or something you thought of as you are learning English, or both?
 
  • #10
Danger said:
What is half of 22th?

11th :-p
 
  • #11
redargon said:
11th :-p
I think that we have contextual disagreement here. By your approach, half of 1/4 would be 1/2.
Oh, wait... I see the problem. I was assuming that there was a 1/ in front of the numbers, since the 'th' indicated a fraction to me.
 
  • #12
jobyts said:
May be, I did not explain my question properly in my original post. I'm not trying to combine both the statements with a single question and single answer.

Let's say, the statement is "Obama is the 44th President of USA". How would you ask a question on this, so that the answer is 44th.

You could ask:
What number president is Obama?

Or, phrased a little differently:
What president number is Obama?

Or, to be more mathematical:
Including Obama, how many presidents of the United States have there been?

EDIT: The answer to the last one might be just a plain 44, but some might say, "He's the 44th President"

EDIT2: Then you'll get the people that ask if that includes acting presidents, or presidents that replaced presidents who died in office, or interrupted consecutive terms, etc. :smile:
 
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  • #13
MATLABdude said:
The answer to the last one might be just a plain 44
No way... Obama is a .44 magnum.
I don't know whether or not Yanks truly understand that the US was pretty much the most hated nation on the planet during the past few decades, even by those who they claimed to be allied with (such as we Canucks). That turned around almost instantly (at least here in Canada) with Obama's election. It gives us all hope that society as a whole might become a bit better, now that you no longer have arrogance and idiocy at the helm.
 
  • #14
Thanks to Grover Cleveland, Obama is actually the 43rd person to be president of the US.

I hope that confuses things even more! :)
 
  • #15
Danger said:
No way... Obama is a .44 magnum.
I don't know whether or not Yanks truly understand that the US was pretty much the most hated nation on the planet during the past few decades, even by those who they claimed to be allied with (such as we Canucks). That turned around almost instantly (at least here in Canada) with Obama's election. It gives us all hope that society as a whole might become a bit better, now that you no longer have arrogance and idiocy at the helm.

What 'choo talking 'bout?
http://blog.pennlive.com/pennsyltucky/2008/01/AP080123017792.jpg

(yes, I'm sorry, it MUST be this big!)
 
Last edited by a moderator:
  • #16
"The how many-eth president of the US is Obama?"
is clear but probably also wrong, I suppose?
 
  • #17
berkeman said:
Where did this question come from? Is it a class assignment, or something you thought of as you are learning English, or both?

I just remembered someone telling me many years ago there's no word for "how many-eth" in English. I just wanted to confirm that. I think most languages have a word for it.

Apparently, in English, there's no direct way to ask a question, if the answer is an adjective. (there could be exceptions)

In my mother tongue (Malayalam: the only language alive which is a palindrom if written in English :)), there's no direct way to ask if the answer is an adjective. But if the adjective is a number or rank, like 44th, there exists a word equivalent to "how many-eth".
 
  • #18
Sorry for the Cheney thing...

The way I'd ask would be:
"Numerically, which president is Obama?"

and

"Regarding population, where does Malaysia rank?" or
"What is Malaysia's rank in terms of population?"
 
  • #19
jobyts said:
I just remembered someone telling me many years ago there's no word for "how many-eth" in English. I just wanted to confirm that. I think most languages have a word for it.

Apparently, in English, there's no direct way to ask a question, if the answer is an adjective. (there could be exceptions)

In my mother tongue (Malayalam: the only language alive which is a palindrom if written in English :)), there's no direct way to ask if the answer is an adjective. But if the adjective is a number or rank, like 44th, there exists a word equivalent to "how many-eth".

The word is nth - pronounced "enth".

Obama is the nth president. What is n?
 
  • #21
Chi, is that Dickless Cheney? I'm not great at remembering faces. :confused:

edit: I just realized after posting that there was a second page. :redface:
 
  • #22
What about, "What is the ordinal number of Obama's presidency?"

(I realize nobody will know what you mean and you'll have to explain it anyway.)
 
  • #23
You can evade asking the direct question by putting it like: "Isn't Obama the 20th president?"
Of course, with the risk that you only get "no, he's not" for an answer.
 
  • #24
jobyts said:
I just remembered someone telling me many years ago there's no word for "how many-eth" in English. I just wanted to confirm that. I think most languages have a word for it.

I don't think it is only English, I can't think a way of asking it in Swedish either (or German, although my German is a bit rusty), at least not in a way that sounds "natural".
Maybe it is a "problem" with all Germanic languages?
What about other indo-european languages?
 
  • #26
f95toli said:
I don't think it is only English, I can't think a way of asking it in Swedish either (or German, although my German is a bit rusty), at least not in a way that sounds "natural".
Maybe it is a "problem" with all Germanic languages?
What about other indo-european languages?

I think in German, it's possible. From the englishforums, someone replied the following:
.
.
.
my native language is German and yeah, in German you could easily ask such a question by "der wievielte?" (lit: "the how manyeth?").
 
  • #27
jobyts said:
in German you could easily ask such a question by "der wievielte?"

You need 'dongleschuessenfeintzerbleaglemachternaschurfritzenbergle' to say 'cat'... and you come up with 3 syllables for 'manyeth'? What the hell is wrong with you people? :-p
 
  • #28
I had complettely forgotten about that word...
So, the question in German would be "Der Wievielte Präsident ist Obama?"

or?
 

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