Do gravitons interact with photons?

  • Context: Graduate 
  • Thread starter Thread starter johne1618
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Gravitons Photons
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the interaction between gravitons and photons, exploring theoretical frameworks such as string theory and effective field theories (EFT). Participants examine concepts related to the curvature of space-time, the nature of massless particles, and the implications of gauge invariance in these interactions.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants inquire whether string theory predicts that gravitons interact with photons, suggesting that the low energy limit of string theory incorporates general relativity and electrodynamics.
  • One participant posits that gravitons interact with space-time, leading to curvature, and that photons, like all entities, follow geodesics in this curved space-time.
  • Another participant describes the theoretical framework where photons are modeled as massless open-string states and gravitons as massless closed-string states, proposing a method to calculate interaction amplitudes.
  • It is noted that gravity couples to photons in an effective field theory, with specific terms in the action indicating this coupling, while also discussing the implications for photon mass and wavefunction renormalization.
  • One participant emphasizes that if gravitons were spin-0 particles, they would not couple to photons in the classical approximation, highlighting the significance of the spin-2 nature of gravitons.
  • Several participants express a desire for mathematical clarity, requesting that equations be presented in LaTeX format for better readability.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the nature of the interaction between gravitons and photons, with some asserting that such interactions are predicted by string theory while others focus on the implications of effective field theories. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the specifics of these interactions and their theoretical underpinnings.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference complex mathematical concepts and frameworks, including effective field theories and string theory, without reaching consensus on the implications or interpretations of these models. There are also mentions of gauge invariance and the historical context of gravitational effects on light.

johne1618
Messages
368
Reaction score
0
Does string theory predict that gravitons interact with photons?

Can a particle traveling linearly at the speed of light curve space-time around it?

I guess a photon could instantaneously have rest mass it if were energetic enough to convert to an electron-positron pair and back again.

John
 
Last edited:
Physics news on Phys.org
I thought gravitons interact with the space-time causing curvature. Thus the concentration of energy and mass in a certain volume indicates the amount of curvature and also the amount of gravitons interacting with space-time. In this sense photons interact with the space-time as all things follow geodesics in curved surfaces.
 
Last edited:
Photons are described by massless open-string state, while gravitons by massless closed-string states. So, the amplitude could be calculated by inserting a graviton vertices in the bulk of a disk and photon vertices on its boundary.
 
You can write down a (nonrenormalizable) EFT with gravity and photons. Gravity does indeed couple to photons; the term in the action would look like int d^4x sqrt(-g)(-1/4) F^2.

As far as the one-loop diagram that looks like photon -> e+ e- -> photon goes, computing the correction to the self-energy results in no shift in the photon mass, but an infinite wavefunction renormalization. The question of the infinity and wavefunction renormalization is a separate one; let's focus on the mass. We discover that the correction to the mass is actually zero, as previously stated. This is good because mass terms are not gauge-invariant. So, the unbroken local gauge symmetry protects the photon's mass. Doing loops involving gravitons in the EFT stated above should result in the same conclusion, despite the math being significantly more awful. Hope this helps.
 
johne1618 said:
Does string theory predict that gravitons interact with photons?

Yes it does! the low energy limit of string theory reproduces GR + electrodynamics + other stuff.

Can a particle traveling linearly at the speed of light curve space-time around it?

I guess a photon could instantaneously have rest mass it if were energetic enough to convert to an electron-positron pair and back again.

If you are asking whether photons couple to gravity in GR then answer is again yeas! The reason is that gravitons are spin-2 particles and they can directly couple to spin-1 photons without violating neither gauge invariance (charge conservation), nor diffeomorphism invariance (recall, in GR the energy-momentum tensor couples to the graviton, not just a mass).

Would the graviton be described by spin-0 particle, there would not be coupling of gravitons with photons (at least in the classical approximation), because the spin-0 particles can interact with the trace of energy-momentum tensor, which is 0 for the electromagnetic field. This crucial difference has been verified experimentally by Sir Arthur Stanley Eddington in 1919 (bending of starlight by Sun's gravitational field)
 
chrispb said:
You can write down a (nonrenormalizable) EFT with gravity and photons. Gravity does indeed couple to photons; the term in the action would look like int d^4x sqrt(-g)(-1/4) F^2.

As far as the one-loop diagram that looks like photon -> e+ e- -> photon goes, computing the correction to the self-energy results in no shift in the photon mass, but an infinite wavefunction renormalization. The question of the infinity and wavefunction renormalization is a separate one; let's focus on the mass. We discover that the correction to the mass is actually zero, as previously stated. This is good because mass terms are not gauge-invariant. So, the unbroken local gauge symmetry protects the photon's mass. Doing loops involving gravitons in the EFT stated above should result in the same conclusion, despite the math being significantly more awful. Hope this helps.

I just want to rewrite this in terms of latex. I hate reading non-latexed stuff. I find myself leaving many pages because it is riddled with all the latex talk, but no latex to show :)

\int \sqrt{-g} -\frac{1}{4} F_{\mu \nu} F^{\mu \nu} d^4 x
 
QuantumClue said:
\int \sqrt{-g} -\frac{1}{4} F_{\mu \nu} F^{\mu \nu} d^4 x

In more details the above equation is:

\int \sqrt{-g} -\frac{1}{4}g^{\mu \rho}g^{\nu \sigma} F_{\mu \nu} F_{\rho \sigma} d^4 x
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
4K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
3K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
2K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
4K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
3K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
2K
  • · Replies 13 ·
Replies
13
Views
5K
  • · Replies 21 ·
Replies
21
Views
7K