Does pursuing wealth make life meaningful?

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I really think in this way:
Life is short, whether I am rich or poor, I will also die one day. Therefore, it is better for me to try my best to acquire WEALTH, so that I can live a life with material satisfaction. I can buy almost whatever I want, I can go to any place I desire. In this way, life will be meaningful to me.:smile:
 

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Yet when you die, you will realize, that to those who cared, you were a waste of time. Give your love, and share your thoughts, or in the end your soul will rot.
 
The genuine values you create and promote during your existence will be your immortality. :devil: :smile: o:)
 
Wealth cannot buy happiness, wealth cannot buy love, wealth cannot buy truth. Live for others, live for light and the greater good and on your deathbed you can look back and say that you leave the world a better place then when you entered it. This alone will afford you comfort in that terrible hour.
 
Ultimately, we all live for satisfaction of one sort or another. I'm not as inclined as these others to fault someone for valuing material satisfaction. If that's what you value, then by all means, pursue that. Who's to say that wealth cannot buy happiness? There is no a priori stricture dictating that no person can be made happy by the acquisition of material wealth. It's possible that the gentleman either doesn't care much about love or truth. It's also possible that pursuing material wealth, while it won't buy him love or truth, won't exactly preclude him from attaining these, either.

Only you can know what you value, and what brings joy to your life. Whatever it is, go for it. Just so long as you aren't stomping on everyone else to get there.
 
dgoodpasture2005 said:
Yet when you die, you will realize, that to those who cared, you were a waste of time. Give your love, and share your thoughts, or in the end your soul will rot.
What is soul? Are you kidding? We may be just a burned off candle.
 
This alone will afford you comfort in that terrible hour.
What is that terrible hour? The moment we die?
It is just a split second, or minute. Why care about it? We need to bother only about things during the time we are still alive, so, go ahead to find as much sensual pleasure as you can. Of course, we also need "peace of mind", peace of mind will only come when our physical bodies are satisfied!
 
Money and sensual pleasures cannot bring you peace of mind. This is a delusion perpetrated by the poor so they can hope for peace in money: perpetrated by the rich so they can think they have peace. I have been poor, most people know what it is like to struggle hard to make ends meet. Few people have riches and pleasures, so they assume that they will bring peace.

They do not. Money and possesions bring comfort to your body, but what are you? You are your thoughts and your mind. Unless they are comforted then you can never be happy. While money certanly makes it easier to spend time figuring out how to be happy, and sensual pleasures will distract you while they continue, neither one changes who you are. Your being is what makes you happy or sad, so only by changing your being can you bring about a change in disposition.
I would contest that this is an a priori fact, that there are certain things which will lead to happiness, and money is not one of them. How many rich people get divorces, commit suicide, get hooked on drugs, etc. These are indicators that they are not happy, but yet they have everything you say should make you happy. Are you happy now? In the dark of night as you lie awake and listen to the world around, are you happy with yourself? Or do you have to shut thoughts out of your mind, hide from facts and fill your life with business to forget how sad you really are.

Sprinter, what will happen when you are aproaching death? It isn't a moment or second, it might take years. What happens when something nearly kills you and you realize that everything you lived for is worthless? The existence you speak of is meaningless, selfish, and narcistic. I warn you, although you might not believe me. No, I beg you, listen to me. The last thing I want is for you to come to the end of your life and realize too late that we were right and you were wrong. By then there will be no time to change the selfishness that plagued your life, the empty struggle to gain a peace that is not yours. If you take your present path in life you will be end like this: alone and depressed. What good will your nonchalant attitude toward death afford you then?
 
Sprinter said:
I really think in this way:
Life is short, whether I am rich or poor, I will also die one day. Therefore, it is better for me to try my best to acquire WEALTH, so that I can live a life with material satisfaction. I can buy almost whatever I want, I can go to any place I desire. In this way, life will be meaningful to me.:smile:

Why not kill a few people on the way while you're at it, you're just going to die anyways and it's not like it's going to matter to you when you're gone.

looseyourname said:
Only you can know what you value, and what brings joy to your life. Whatever it is, go for it. Just so long as you aren't stomping on everyone else to get there.

And therein lies the problem. How can you obtain wealth by not stomping on someone? Somewhere along the line there is poverty, especially in the world we live in today.
 
Dawguard,

What is life? It just happens by chance, doesn't it? My parents can plan to have a child, but they can't determine who is the child. I exist by chance. I am basically made of materials and survive on materials too. What can be more important than materials?
I admit that i am poor, therefore i envy rich people. Eventually all of us will die, why not i do something to get more sensual pleasure?
What is mind? If you are starving, can your mind change your starvation? Only bread can change it, not the so-called power of mind!
 
Sprinter said:
What is life? It just happens by chance, doesn't it? My parents can plan to have a child, but they can't determine who is the child. I exist by chance.
True, but this is irrelevant to what makes life happy.

Sprinter said:
I am basically made of materials and survive on materials too. What can be more important than materials?
Your body is material, but you mind is what you are. If you loose a hand are you any less of yourself? You could be nothing but a head supported by some weird, sci-fi contraption, but you would still be yourself. You are not your body, you are your mind with your body nothing more then a shell.

Sprinter said:
I admit that i am poor, therefore i envy rich people. Eventually all of us will die, why not i do something to get more sensual pleasure?
What is mind? If you are starving, can your mind change your starvation? Only bread can change it, not the so-called power of mind!
No, if you are starving your mind cannot change that, but I never said being poor was good. I said that having money can help you, but it is not indicitive of happiness. There are poor people who, despite their lack of physical comforts, are very happy people. How would you explain this? How do you explain miserable rich people? There are happy and miserable poor: happy and miserable rich. What this indicates is that wealth is not the cause of joy. You need to be at peace with yourself, and this is something money cannot buy.
 
It is not what you have but how you obtain it that ultimately determines its value. Money is just fancy paper unsuitable for bung fodder. If you earn it, it becomes a possession of pride and you will spend it wisely. If you obtain it by dishonorable means it becomes a token of your dishonor. Money can be your servant or your master regardless of how much you have at your disposal. Take care to remember that what you have is not what determines who you are. How you define wealth now will ultimately determine the meaning it has for you once you achieve it.
 
There are poor people who, despite their lack of physical comforts, are very happy people. How would you explain this? How do you explain miserable rich people? There are happy and miserable poor: happy and miserable rich. What this indicates is that wealth is not the cause of joy. You need to be at peace with yourself, and this is something money cannot buy.
This is Complacency! They are not truly happy, they just pretend to be happy. In their hearts, they are actually unhappy and feeling jealous of rich people.
Most of them use religious thinking to comfort themselves, such as regarding KARMA of past life has determined their current states, therefore they have to ACCEPT their situations. Some think that GOD has pre-destined them to be like that, and hope that poverty means less tendency to sin and so can secure a place in heaven.
Ha ha ha, this is the so called Opiate of Mind!
 
How you define wealth now will ultimately determine the meaning it has for you once you achieve it.
If I am starving now, I need 10 dollar to buy food, the meaning of 10 dollar is intrinsically important, it is regardless of my mindset about money.
 
Sprinter said:
This is Complacency! They are not truly happy, they just pretend to be happy. In their hearts, they are actually unhappy and feeling jealous of rich people.
Most of them use religious thinking to comfort themselves, such as regarding KARMA of past life has determined their current states, therefore they have to ACCEPT their situations. Some think that GOD has pre-destined them to be like that, and hope that poverty means less tendency to sin and so can secure a place in heaven.
Ha ha ha, this is the so called Opiate of Mind!
You ignored my last point, miserable rich people. There are people who have everything life could offer them, but are still depresed, miserable people. How could you explain this? They have sensual pleasures, comforts, money, inherited it all so they could have all the time to enjoy everything, and yet they are still miserable!
Besides, how can you say they are not happy? What makes it possible for you to judge the fact that they are lying? If they say they are happy how can you make a blanket statement that none of them are?

As for your last post, this is entirely off the point. I am not talking about money that enables you to live. First comes survival, and then comes everything else. If you are struggling just to survive then of course you will spend your time trying to get money. I'm not trying to bash the importance of money for survival, but there is a difference between survival and happiness. Will the food make you happy? It will allieve your starvation and comfort your body, but after that, after survival is taken care of, what good can money do to make you happy?
 
I agree that a small group of people are not happy though they are damn rich, but this does not mean money can not buy happiness!
They are rich but unhappy, probably due to their unsatiable GREED.
What I actually emphasize is a balance between material and spiritual bliss.
First, we need to define what is happiness, to know how to gain it, money could be one the means to get it, there is nothing wrong with desiring money as long as you can get it legally and morally, and most important is to make sure you make use of money wisely.
However, there are also many people who are happy just because of having a lot of money, because with money, they can own almost whatever they desire and be truly happy!
 
what good can money do to make you happy?
It depends on individual!
To me, I like reading, if I got a lot of money (let's say 100 million dollar), I will set up a private library and buy 1 million books that I like, I will resign my job, everyday I stay inside my library reading books. When I feel bored, I will go out for outdoor activities. And I will also travel to many good places of the world. And I will eat all kinds of good food over the world.
Isn't that an ideal life?
 
What about those who will currently be in the condition and situation that you were once in? What about life and survival? Caring? Giving? Will you take for granted the breath that you breathe, while others die of starvation when you can knowingly save them and make the world a better place? Or will the thoughts ever cross your mind? Money is both necessary and evil, yet it doesn't have to be that way.
 
Don't you find sensual pleasures superficial, as if there is some deeper joy to be reached by knowledge of your wants, which are derived from your thoughts?

Let's say you are born into an imaginary society, where you have your basic needs met and you are not influenced in any way whatsoever by anything around you. In that way, your mind does not build up images and associate feelings with those images. Do you think you will naturally gravitate to a materialistic existence? If the feeling that you will not somehow be improved by a material object does not exist, do you think the desire for that object will still persist? If not, doesn't this imply that our desires for material goods beyond those which afford us life are merely products of our upbringing and our society around us? And if that is the case, this would seem to imply that there is a deeper pleasure to be sought after, only attainable by the understanding of our minds.
 
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I concur Lewis. Great post :) Although it was hard for me to logically follow growing up in an imaginary society :P. I think another good example would be something like this, "what if you started out life in 'the modern world' at 21 years old, after growing up in an African tribe?". What would have meaning to you? Our society is a reflection of who we are as a whole, yet our society also reflects us as individuals. Since our society is not an individual, it's up to the individual to change the society and/or outcome of the individuals future actions. On another note, I wish our society acted as an individual, as in working in unison towards a common positive goal. We have become slaves to ourselves so that we can continue to purchase the latest technological or fashion crave. I think we're going to get sick of it soon. I am.
 
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dgoodpasture2005 said:
I concur Lewis. Great post :) Although it was hard for me to logically follow growing up in an imaginary society :P. I think another good example would be something like this, "what if you started out life in 'the modern world' at 21 years old, after growing up in an African tribe?". What would have meaning to you? Our society is a reflection of who we are, yet we are also a reflection of our society. Since our society is not an individual, it's up to the individual to change the society and/or outcome of the individuals future actions. On another note, I wish our society acted as an individual, as in working in unison towards a common positive goal. We have become slaves to ourselves so that we can continue to purchase the latest technological or fashion crave. I think we're going to get sick of it soon. I am.

Sorry for the confusion. When I said imaginary society, I mearly meant create the abstraction of not growing up with any influences. It's only imaginary because it doesn't (to my knowledge) exist in the world.

What you said about growing up in one society is a good example of what I meant. It seems to be plainly clear that our personal wants are a reflection of how we grew up(but not exclusively so), i.e. what our parents were like, what our school was like, how we spent our time outside of school, etc. The one thread that binds these things is our memory and our thoughts. The former conforms the latter; the way we think is a direct consequence of the life we have lived, which is contained for future reference for us in our memories.

So, if you ever want to discover what life is truly about and why it is worth living, it is first essential to understand the way we think, and to rid ourselves of those memories which conform us.
 
Exactly, exactly. Perceptional alternation between realities and perspectives. If we can't see further than our own two eyes, we'll never change. Yet, then again, who's to say that we all desire change? Most don't even realize it 'till they're on their death beds. I think right now, as a world society... we're on our death beds. We need to change before we flatline. Just my opinion. Oh, by the way, there was no confusion, I was just poking a little fun at the logic of the terminology :) I understood... feel free to do it back.
 
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If change is desired it will never come, it will merely end up in the way of all other desires: conflict.

Desire itself is the true problem. It is desire that is the product of your memories and therefore a product of the past. If you ever want to bring about change you must not act from the past. So change will only come once we have abandoned memories.
 
It depends, if the desired change is love and effection, it can be done by example and surely achieved. As human beings, all we have is the future and the past. But you are right. We can now learn from the past and start to think in present times; the moment. In the moment is created both the future and the past, and the future and the past are now within the moment. Once we can truly grasp this and it has meaning, we can become more conscious and aware of what it is that we are doing to ourselves and the world, the future and current implications, and the change that needs to be seen. Todays a new day... this second is a new second. Right our wrongs and start new. But it takes everyone. It's never too late to start... and it's never too little to start with. Example goes a long way. (as you can see, when we fight, we fight... when we're at peace, we're at peace... but who's setting the example?)
 
We had best not get too far off the subject, I would like to see how Sprinter responds to the above few posts first before continuing
 
haha, you're right. It was enjoyable though. Thank you. Can't wait to continue it, in the meantime, take it easy Lewis.
 
dgoodpasture2005 said:
What about those who will currently be in the condition and situation that you were once in? What about life and survival? Caring? Giving? Will you take for granted the breath that you breathe, while others die of starvation when you can knowingly save them and make the world a better place? Or will the thoughts ever cross your mind? Money is both necessary and evil, yet it doesn't have to be that way.
Sorry, I don't think I can change the world, I am one of the people who toils to survive.
I can donate a little money for charity, but how many times can I do that? Some terrible situations in the world, such as famine + civil war in Africa , are political problems that I really can not do anything to help rectify the situations.
So, why bother about it?:frown:
 
I think:
1) Happiness can not be independent of external conditions. For instance, you may know meditation and enjoy its spiritual pleasure; while sitting in a room meditating, a fire breaks and burns the house, are you able to continue meditating and enjoy it? Surely you will evacuate in panic.

So, I believe happiness (of mind and body) must be closely related to outside world, and obviously, MONEY is an effective mean to achieve it, the most direct way to get it.
 
So, you think the world can change you, but you can't change the world? It's the people in this world that make you what you are, and it's the way this world works that puts you in the position that you are in. Why is it that others can effect you... but you feel as if you don't have this same power as well?
 
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One of the biggest issue of the world is Economy. Economy is about what? Basically about commodity! When economy is bad, it always means survival is difficult, job is difficult to get, prices of good are high etc...such as the asean economy crisis in 1997.
Economy has nothing to do with "mind", it is entirely about physical needs! And Economy is a key factor that will determine the happiness of most people, I can say the whole world!
The embodiment of economy is MONEY, dollar and cent, when everone has enough money to buy what they want, he/she will be happy.