Dragon flight and whether it would be possible

  • Context: Undergrad 
  • Thread starter Thread starter huggy bear
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Flight
Click For Summary
SUMMARY

The discussion centers on the feasibility of dragon flight, specifically the calculations needed to determine the wing span and area for a dragon weighing 200 pounds and measuring 20 feet in length. Peter Dickinson's book "The Flight of Dragons" posits that a full-sized dragon would require an impractical wingspan of 600 feet due to its weight of 20,000 pounds. Participants debate the biological mechanics of flight, suggesting that a dragon's design should differ from that of airplanes, emphasizing the need for maneuverability and propulsion through wings. The conversation also touches on the potential use of lighter-than-air gases and the comparison to pterosaurs as a realistic model for dragon flight.

PREREQUISITES
  • Understanding of basic aerodynamics principles
  • Familiarity with the physics of lift and drag
  • Knowledge of biological structures in flying animals
  • Experience with mathematical formulas related to flight mechanics
NEXT STEPS
  • Research the physics of lift and how it applies to wing area calculations
  • Study the anatomy and flight mechanics of pterosaurs for design inspiration
  • Explore mathematical models for calculating wing span based on weight
  • Investigate the properties of lighter-than-air gases and their potential applications in flight
USEFUL FOR

This discussion is beneficial for fantasy writers, aerospace engineers, and enthusiasts interested in the realistic portrayal of mythical creatures, particularly those exploring the mechanics of flight in fictional contexts.

huggy bear
Messages
6
Reaction score
0
I'm wrestling with the question of dragon flight and whether it would be possible/feasible.
I've read the book "the Flight of Dragons" Peter Dickinson, Harper & row, 1979.

Dickinson argues that for a full sized dragon, which he puts at 90 feet long, six feet wide and 20,000 pounds, a dragon would need a wingspan of 600 feet (16,000 square feet) which is (according to him) aerodynamically impossible.
Dickinson theorizes that if dragons existed they would have flown by biologically produced, lighter than air gasses (like a zeppelin).

I want to know how i could calculate the wing span/area required for a 20ft 200lb dragon without gasses.

OR

what would be the maximum feasible dimensions for a purely wing powered dragon?
 
Science news on Phys.org


I don't see anything that fundamentally prevents you taking an old design for a two-passenger glider, and replacing wood and canvas with bone and leather, for an idea of what a biologically engineered dragon might be like. That weight-estimate sounds excessive to me, don't birds tend to have light bodies (compared to their size and fierceness)?
 


Depends on your dragon...if you're looking into it as a reptilian dragon, then your design should be somewhat different from that of an airplane.
 


a reptilian dragon.

the design would differ from that of a plane because the wings are the means of propulsion as well as lift, and there needs to be a degree of maneuverability, and many myths refer to an ability to hover.

and both weight estimates seem pretty spot on to me (except mine might be a bit light, seriously, it's 20ft long, include internal organs, giant talons, a huge armoured head and flight muscles, as well as the scaly, armoured hide, that's a lot of weight, maybe it should be adjusted to 300lb...)
 


What's the point? If you are writing about dragons then your readers obviously are not that stuck on realism. Just make their scales magically force air down, then they can be as large as you want and only need their wings for steering.
 


dude, the point is to try and be realistic (at least, within the realms of physical possibility) i want to actually calculate wing span/area, i looked up some formulas on the interwebz and it all got too complicated, so i hoped someone nerdy (read: smart/can be bothered/already knows how/is experienced in the field) could just, like pull a formula from their arse and just say; "here, use this" all you guys have given me is ideas I've already had.

also this is a physics forum, if i could f*ck with the laws of physics (or thought i could) would I be here right now?

EDIT: if i was being insulting/condescending I'm Sorry: it's because I'm used to gaming forums, where the whole point is to be condescending/call each other n00bs
 


Please don't use offensive language. This is not an adolescent board. We don't allow slang.

Concerning the OP: what's wrong with *actual* flying reptilian "dragons": pterosaurs ?
 


we need FOUR legged reptiles with wings & teeth, besides all i want is a formula relating wing area to lift in flying animals, that's all I'm asking for, no extra suggestions, just a formula
 

Similar threads

Why is the U-2 nicknamed the Dragon Lady?
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
9K
Kerbal Space Program - Rocket Design Basics
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
10K