Entaglement, locality, and information

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the concepts of entanglement, locality, and information within the framework of quantum mechanics and general relativity. Participants explore the implications of entanglement on notions of causality and the distinction between causal and non-causal interactions, as well as the role of information in these contexts.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants assert that entanglement implies non-local interactions, questioning how this aligns with the principle that no information travels faster than light.
  • There are two notions of causality discussed: one that does not rely on information, which some argue is violated by quantum entanglement, and another that does rely on information, which maintains locality.
  • Participants express uncertainty about what distinguishes causal interactions from non-causal ones, with non-causal interactions suggested to be those that propagate faster than light.
  • One participant challenges the assertion that entanglement leads to non-local interactions, referencing Bell's Theorem as a counterpoint.
  • Another participant mentions that the distinction between the two notions of causality may be better framed in terms of "real" versus "operational" causality.
  • There is a reference to a paper that reviews different notions of causality, suggesting that the physics of Bell's theorem is not controversial despite debates over its historical interpretation.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not appear to reach consensus, as there are competing views on the implications of entanglement for locality and causality, as well as differing interpretations of Bell's Theorem.

Contextual Notes

Some participants highlight the need for clarity regarding definitions of information and causality, as well as the implications of different interpretations of quantum mechanics and relativity.

hideelo
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As far as I understand, given that there is such a thing called entanglement, we know that there are non-local interactions. The line that this is usually followed with is "since no information traveled faster than light , locality isn't violated".

I have a few interrelated questions about this. As far as I know in GR, we demand that all real particles travel through spacetime with tangent vectors which are non-positive. No mention of information, it's a constraint on allowed tangent vectors of particles.

We have another assumed condition on "causality" which takes explicitly that two regions in spacetime which can be connected by timeliness or null curves are said to be in causal contact with each other. This also makes no reference to information, but does seem to have a notion that causal interactions do not propagate faster than light. What distinguishes causal interactions from non causal ones?

A final question, what is information, and why would it be the measure of what can and cannot travel faster than light?
 
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There are two notions of causality, one not relying on information and the other one relying on information.

For the one that does not rely on information (the sense in which classical relativity is a theory of causality), quantum entanglement breaks it - ie. reality is nonlocal or weirder.

For the one that does rely on information, quantum entanglement does not break it. Here the notion of information is simple. Two observers widely separated make measurements. Can I, making measurements on my side, figure out what he is doing? It turns out that in quantum mechanics, I cannot. Since none of his actions make any difference to the outcomes of my measurements, he is unable to transmit any information to me.
 
I'm sorry, I really don't see how that clarifies anything
 
hideelo said:
all real particles travel through spacetime with tangent vectors which are non-positive.

That's using a Lorentz signature like ( -, +, +, +) of course
hideelo said:
causal interactions do not propagate faster than light. What distinguishes causal interactions from non causal ones?

Non-causal would be the ones that do propagate faster than light, i.e. non-local. The only one I know of is entanglement. Many physicists would argue it doesn't really qualify, but perhaps we can treat that as a nit for this question.
hideelo said:
A final question, what is information, and why would it be the measure of what can and cannot travel faster than light?

That's clarified by atyy's answer
 
hideelo said:
As far as I understand, given that there is such a thing called entanglement, we know that there are non-local interactions.

That's incorrect.

You need to study Bells Theorem:
http://www.drchinese.com/Bells_Theorem.htm

Thanks
Bill
 
hideelo said:
I'm sorry, I really don't see how that clarifies anything

As you said in your original post, there are two notions of causality
(1) one notion involves "real" causality and does not involve any notion of information - using this notion, QM is nonlocal
(2) a different notion is usually said to involve information - a better term may be that it is an "operational" notion of causality - using this notion, QM is local

A good paper reviewing the different notions of causality is http://arxiv.org/abs/1503.06413. In section 5.1 they explain Bell's theorem in terms of the realist notion of causality, and in 5.2 they explain it in terms of the operational ("information") notion of causality.

There is some debate over the historical interpretation of Bell's work in that paper, but the physics itself is not controversial.
 

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