Exploring Nature's Constants: Manipulating Variables in the Lab

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Discussion Overview

The discussion explores the hypothetical manipulation of nature's constants in a laboratory setting, particularly focusing on how changing these constants could affect the properties of a marble placed in an aquarium. Participants consider both dimensionless and dimensionful constants, their implications, and the potential outcomes of such alterations.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant proposes that altering dimensionless constants could change the size and properties of the marble, suggesting that changing the electron mass could make the marble larger or smaller.
  • Another participant notes that changing the fine-structure constant might not only affect the marble's size but could also render it radioactive or cause it to explode if made too radioactive.
  • A different viewpoint suggests that making the strong interaction weaker could lead to radioactivity or an explosion, while making it stronger may not have significant effects.
  • There is a discussion about the relevance of dimensionful constants, with some participants questioning their meaningfulness in this context and comparing them to unit conversions that do not affect physical systems.
  • One participant emphasizes the speculative nature of the discussion, suggesting it may be more suited for science fiction rather than rigorous scientific inquiry.
  • Another participant seeks clarification on the analogy of dimensionful constants being like unit conversions, asking for examples to illustrate this point.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the significance and impact of dimensionful versus dimensionless constants, with no consensus reached on their relevance or the outcomes of altering them. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the implications of such manipulations.

Contextual Notes

Participants acknowledge the vast number of combinations of constants that could be altered, but there is uncertainty about how these changes would manifest in a physical system, particularly regarding interactions with the outside world.

star apple
If supposed you could locally change any constant of nature in a test area in the lab say the the size of aquarium and you put a marble inside.. could you make the marble bigger and smaller, heavier or lighter by adjusting any of the parameters? or even make the marble explode? What would happen in such case? Please mention all combinations with different constant of nature parameters values and share what you think would happen. Thanks.
 
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Note that you can only change dimensionless constants in a meaningful way.

Changing the electron mass (its coupling to the Higgs) would change the size of the marble (lighter -> larger).
Changing the fine-structure constant would change its size as well, but potentially make it radioactive (and if you make it too radioactive, it explodes).
Making the strong interaction significantly weaker would make it radioactive or would make it explode directly. Making it stronger shouldn't have a strong effect.

"Heavier" and "lighter" needs an interaction with the outside world where it is unclear how that is supposed to look like (do we use the constants for the marble or the constants for Earth?).

Most constants wouldn't have a relevant impact as they only apply to particles not present in the marble.
star apple said:
Please mention all combinations with different constant of nature parameters values and share what you think would happen.
There are millions of combinations.
 
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mfb said:
Note that you can only change dimensionless constants in a meaningful way.

why didn't you mention "dimensionfull constants".. can't you change dimensionfull constants in a meaningful way? why? any example?

Changing the electron mass (its coupling to the Higgs) would change the size of the marble (lighter -> larger).
Changing the fine-structure constant would change its size as well, but potentially make it radioactive (and if you make it too radioactive, it explodes).
Making the strong interaction significantly weaker would make it radioactive or would make it explode directly. Making it stronger shouldn't have a strong effect.

"Heavier" and "lighter" needs an interaction with the outside world where it is unclear how that is supposed to look like (do we use the constants for the marble or the constants for Earth?).

Most constants wouldn't have a relevant impact as they only apply to particles not present in the marble.There are millions of combinations.
 
Moving this thread to science fiction because of its potential.

The notion of changing the key parameters can be done in a myriad of ways far too many to discuss meaningfully here. However, anyone such combination could be the basis for some science fiction story yet to be written.

Let’s try to keep the discussion simple and focused from peer reviewed papers only even while it may be somewhat too speculative for PF.
 
jedishrfu said:
Moving this thread to science fiction because of its potential.

The notion of changing the key parameters can be done in a myriad of ways far too many to discuss meaningfully here. However, anyone such combination could be the basis for some science fiction story yet to be written.

Let’s try to keep the discussion simple and focused from peer reviewed papers only even while it may be somewhat too speculative for PF.

All right.
Dear creative team. What constant of nature alteration can you make that can make the marble float inside the aquarium size localized sector where you can change any constant of natures and see the effect?
 
star apple said:
why didn't you mention "dimensionfull constants".. can't you change dimensionfull constants in a meaningful way? why? any example?
Changing other constants is like changing the mile to kilometer conversion. A mile is now 2 km long. So what? That doesn't change the marble at all. It just changes the unit system without impact on the physical system.
 
mfb said:
Changing other constants is like changing the mile to kilometer conversion. A mile is now 2 km long. So what? That doesn't change the marble at all. It just changes the unit system without impact on the physical system.

Can you please give an example of what you meant that "Changing other constants is like changing the mile to kilometer conversion."? What were you referring to? Is it about dimensionful constants that I was asking? If so.. why would changing dimensionful constants be like changing mile to kilometer? Please give an example to illustrate the idea. Thank you.
 
All dimensionful constants are just like the "fundamental constant" X = 1.60934 miles/km. Just conversions between units where we could have chosen the same units but did not for practical reasons or our lack of knowledge when they were introduced.
 
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