Finite-Temperature Schrödinger's equation

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    Schrodinger's equation
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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the finite-temperature Schrödinger's equation as it applies to the hydrogen atom. Participants explore the implications of temperature on energy levels and the potential use of perturbation theory in this context, as well as the relationship between statistical mechanics and quantum mechanics.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant inquires about solutions to the finite-temperature Schrödinger's equation for the hydrogen atom and the possibility of using perturbation theory to calculate new energy levels at a given temperature.
  • Another participant asserts that the energy states of the hydrogen atom do not change with temperature, questioning the need for a new formula.
  • A participant challenges this view by referencing a specific paper and asking about the mathematical description of a hydrogen atom at temperature T.
  • There is a discussion about the relevance of a new term in the Hamiltonian and whether it leads to new energy levels, with a participant arguing that the Hamiltonian in question is not applicable to a single atom.
  • One participant suggests creating a partition function as a method to approach the problem, while another expresses unfamiliarity with statistical mechanics in the context of quantum mechanics and requests further clarification or resources.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on whether temperature affects the energy levels of the hydrogen atom, leading to an unresolved debate regarding the application of statistical mechanics to quantum systems.

Contextual Notes

There is a lack of consensus on the applicability of perturbation theory and the interpretation of new terms in the Hamiltonian, as well as the integration of statistical mechanics with quantum mechanics. Some assumptions about the nature of energy levels and temperature effects remain unaddressed.

Gavroy
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hi,

i am interested in solutions to the finite-temperature schrödinger's equation for the hydrogen atom. does anybody know whether there are such?

or does anybody of you know whether there is a possiblity to use something like pertubation theory to calculate the new energy-levels of the hydrogen atom at some temperature?
 
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What "new" energy levels? The states themselves don't change with temperature.
 
are you sure? then why do they invent this new formula.
http://arxiv.org/PS_cache/arxiv/pdf/1005/1005.2751v3.pdf" (23).
does a new term in the hamiltonian not result in new energy levels?

or let me ask it in a different way: what exactly happens when a hydrogen atom is at temperature T and how can i describe this state(or this fluctuation, whatever it is) mathematically?
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Gavroy said:
are you sure? then why do they invent this new formula.

Yes I'm sure. That doesn't show otherwise either. A more important question to Why did they invent it:
Where/when has anyone used it? I do actual finite temperature calculations on atoms and molecules all the time, and I certainly haven't either seen it or needed it.
does a new term in the hamiltonian not result in new energy levels?

That's not the Hamiltonian of a single atom or a single particle. You're comparing apples to oranges.
or let me ask it in a different way: what exactly happens when a hydrogen atom is at temperature T and how can i describe this state(or this fluctuation, whatever it is) mathematically?

Create a partition function. Don't you know statistical thermodynamics at all?
 
Last edited:
alxm said:
Create a partition function. Don't you know statistical thermodynamics at all?

no, up to now, i was only concerned with mechanics, classical field theory and qm...

actually, it is completely new to me to use statistical mechanics in hydrogen atoms, that have discrete energy levels. how does statistical mechanics work with quantum mechanics?

if it is not too demending, it would be great if you could write down the correct function that gives me the probability for hydrogen atoms at a finite temperature or you could give me a link, where they deal with this problem.


thanks for your help
 

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