First passage time for Kinetic Monte Carlo model

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion focuses on finding the first passage time for a kinetic Monte Carlo model, specifically examining a linear kinetic model with multiple states and known transition rates. Participants explore analytical solutions for the probability density of first passage times from an initial state to any target state, considering the implications of modifying the model to include absorbing states.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant proposes treating the target state as an absorbing state to derive the first passage time distribution, suggesting that the cumulative distribution function (cdf) can be expressed in terms of a matrix exponential.
  • Another participant attempts to implement this approach using a transition matrix in MATLAB but encounters issues with the norm of the probability vector increasing without bound, questioning the need for renormalization.
  • Concerns are raised about the transition matrix having positive eigenvalues after modifying the state to be absorbing, which seems to contradict the expected behavior of the system.
  • A participant acknowledges a misunderstanding regarding the conservation of probability, noting that the introduction of an absorbing state alters the dynamics, leading to a non-zero total change in probability.
  • Discrepancies between the analytical results and simulation outcomes are highlighted, particularly regarding the speed at which the probability of being in the absorbing state approaches 1.
  • Another participant suggests that the transition matrix should maintain conservation of probability, indicating that the modified process should not violate this principle despite the introduction of an absorbing state.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the implications of modifying the transition matrix and the behavior of the probability vector. There is no consensus on the resolution of the issues raised, particularly regarding the treatment of absorbing states and the resulting eigenvalues.

Contextual Notes

The discussion reveals limitations in the assumptions about the transition matrix and the implications of introducing absorbing states. The relationship between the eigenvalues and the conservation of probability remains unresolved.

phyalan
Messages
21
Reaction score
0
Hi all!
I have a problem on finding the first passage time for kinetic monte carlo model.
Suppose I have a linear kinetic model for n states:
S1<->S2<->S3<->...<->Sn
where all the rate constants k_ij for transition between any two states are known. Is there any general way to find out the analytical solution for the (probability density) of the first passage time from state 1 to any state i?
Many thanks!
 
Physics news on Phys.org
One approach is to consider a modified version of the process where state i is an absorbing state (i.e. no transitions out of state i) which will have the same first passage time distribution for state i. Since i is absorbing, the cdf of the first passage time will equal the probability that the process is in state i at time t, which can be solve in terms of a matrix exponential.
 
bpet said:
One approach is to consider a modified version of the process where state i is an absorbing state (i.e. no transitions out of state i) which will have the same first passage time distribution for state i. Since i is absorbing, the cdf of the first passage time will equal the probability that the process is in state i at time t, which can be solve in terms of a matrix exponential.
Thanks for your comment. So I try P(t)=P(0)e^{Tt}, where T is the transition matrix with state i being the absorption state, t is the time and P(t) is the probability vector of different states with norm equal 1. I solved the equation in MATLAB numerically and I observed some strange things:
1. the norm of P(t) keep increasing in time without bound, do I have to renormalized it at each time? \overline{P(t)}=P(t)/norm(P(t))
2. if I do the renormalization, P(t) become stationary after some time t, but the probability of the absorption state is not 1 in stationary solution. Since there is only one state keep absorbing, I would expect at the end I should certainly find the system in the absorbing state. What is wrong with my solution?
 
Renormalisation shouldn't be necessary and if the transition matrix is written correctly, it shouldn't have any positive eigenvalues. Perhaps show your solution for n=i=2?
 
My system is actually more complicated than a linear markov chain, in the sense that the transition matrix is not tridiagonal. But I think theory still applies. What happened is the transition matrix for original system has all its eigenvalues <0 but by doing the tricks that modifying one of the state to be absorbing state, one of the eigenvalues now become positive. Do I miss something important or does the trick just not apply?
 
Ok, I have been stupid about it. Since I have changed one state to absorbing state, the total change of probability for all the states is not zero now, \sum\frac{dP_i}{dt}≠0. Hence the probability vector keeps increasing due to one and only one positive eigenvalue. But it is still strange that the time it takes for the probability of being in absorbing state i increases to 1 (so the cdf of first passage time reaches 1 as well) so quickly. The result does not agree with the simulation result from stochastic model of the same system...
 
I can't say much without seeing more details but the transition matrix of the modified process should be the same except with a row of zeros for the absorbing state - that shouldn't break the law of conservation of probability.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
1K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K
Replies
0
Views
2K
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
3K
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
3K
Replies
0
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
1K