Flavors of the Past: Classic Recipes vs. Modern Blasphemy

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the trend of modern reinterpretations of classic recipes, particularly focusing on how these updates often stray far from traditional ingredients and methods. Participants express their frustrations with these changes, citing specific examples like chicken cacciatore and baklava, and questioning the legitimacy of such adaptations.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Exploratory
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants argue that traditional recipes should be preserved and that altering key ingredients disqualifies the dish from being called by its original name.
  • Others express disbelief at the modern adaptations, such as tofu chicken cacciatore and cheesy baklava, suggesting these versions are unrecognizable and not true to their roots.
  • A few participants highlight the existence of vegetarian options, questioning whether they should retain the original names if they lack the primary ingredients.
  • There is a suggestion that chefs should create new names for their reinterpretations to avoid confusion and honor the original dishes.
  • Some participants share their personal experiences and frustrations with the decline of traditional cooking practices in restaurants.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree that many modern adaptations of classic recipes are unsatisfactory and misrepresent the original dishes. However, there is disagreement on whether vegetarian adaptations can still be considered valid interpretations of the original recipes.

Contextual Notes

Participants express various assumptions about the nature of traditional recipes and the implications of changing key ingredients. There is an acknowledgment of dietary changes, such as vegetarianism, but no consensus on how these should influence recipe naming conventions.

  • #31
radou said:
Are you from the Balkan?

Nah, I'm from the east US, Pennsylvania, to be more precise. I know we have baklava around here, but I thought it was due to the ethnic makeup of my area. I didn't know that is was equally as popular elsewhere in the states.

When I said, "across the US" I meant the other parts of the US where I don't live. Sorry for the confusion.:smile:
 
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  • #32
Evo said:
Actually, it's closer to spanakopita, at least that's not a sweet desert.
I think of spanakopita as "spinach pie with a filling of spinach, feta cheese (usually), green onions, egg, and seasoning (often including dill)." I know there is a different name when meat is the main filling - possibly - Bougatsa (Greek Μπουγάτσα, Turkish boğaça) - a pastry constiting of custard, cheese, or minced meat filling between layers of phyllo.

or http://www.eatgreektonight.com/recipe.cfm?TypeID=4&RecipeID=70 - Minced meat stuffed in a fyllo (phyllo) pastry.

I suppose sausage instead of minced meat counts. :rolleyes:

Here is a list of classic Greek meat dishes
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greek_cuisine#Meat_dishes

and here is a list of classic Greek desserts and sweets
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greek_cuisine#Desserts_and_sweets

There is a difference! :rolleyes:

A great site for Greek cuisine -
http://www.eatgreektonight.com/recipes.cfm
 
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  • #33
AAAACCKK!

I'm cooking corned beef with cabbage tonight and out of curiosity I looked up some recipes.

Oh my god, these idiots are talking about honey glaze for corned beef! With cabbage no less! Corned beef does not have a honey glaze nor does it have a sugar glaze (another idiotic recipe I found) and you don't put barbecue sauce on it.
 
  • #34
You can probably thank the food network for that.
 
  • #35
Evo said:
AAAACCKK!

I'm cooking corned beef with cabbage tonight and out of curiosity I looked up some recipes.

Oh my god, these idiots are talking about honey glaze for corned beef! With cabbage no less! Corned beef does not have a honey glaze nor does it have a sugar glaze (another idiotic recipe I found) and you don't put barbecue sauce on it.
Idiots! Corned beef is something that you don't screw with. If it's proper corned beef, you don't have to just stick with cabbage, potatoes, etc, but you can use any (mostly root) vegetables that you have on hand to make a delicious meal. Corned beef went on "special" here around St Patrick's day, but it was a WHOLE lot cheaper after that when the over-orders got sold off, and we would have great early-spring boiled dinners with our potatoes, carrots, turnips, etc from the previous growing season. With our salted leeks, chives, garlic, etc, and we were "stylin' " on the cheap.

My father is 81 and he still has a little garden, but I remember when I was a kid (before I got to 14-15 years old and could earn real money), caring for a garden about 10 times that size was my job, and my mother and I canned and pickled and froze enough vegetables and wild berries to keep our grocery list minimal. These days, when my wife goes shopping, her list might look like "mayonnaise, blade steaks, coffee, milk, potatoes, peppers, grapes" or something similar, though once the garden starts coming in, we hone in on those foods and our food purchases are minimal.
 
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  • #36
cyrusabdollahi said:
You can probably thank the food network for that.
I DO!

Corned beef has a unique taste that makes it unmistakeably corned beef, that's why you buy it, you don't buy it and then try to make it NOT taste like corned beef. :bugeye: :eek:

It's like buying pastrami and trying to make it taste like fried fish.

THAT'S CRAZY!
 
  • #37
Evo, most people have not had real corned beef. Most people have not had real salt pork or real smoked bacon or salted leeks or fresh (or fermented) apple cider. Most people in this country are so removed from the sources of their food that they wouldn't recognize a beef stomach lining (tripe) or a pig's intestine (large=blood sausage casing, small= regular sausage casing) if they were beaten over the head with them. My wife and I are trying to remove ourselves as much as possible from the commercial crap being sold at the retail level, and get as much meat as we can from local organic farmers, while growing/harvesting as much cultivated/wild food as we can to fill our freezers.
 
  • #38
turbo-1 said:
Evo, most people have not had real corned beef. Most people have not had real salt pork or real smoked bacon or salted leeks or fresh (or fermented) apple cider. Most people in this country are so removed from the sources of their food that they wouldn't recognize a beef stomach lining (tripe) or a pig's intestine (large=blood sausage casing, small= regular sausage casing) if they were beaten over the head with them. My wife and I are trying to remove ourselves as much as possible from the commercial crap being sold at the retail level, and get as much meat as we can from local organic farmers, while growing/harvesting as much cultivated/wild food as we can to fill our freezers.
KUDOS to you and your wife!

We really need to preserve traditional recipes and make people realize if it deviates from the traditional, its not the same dish and needs to be renamed. Nothing wrong with creating a new dish, just DON'T bastardize the real deal.

There are cetain cooking terms, like florentine, that means with spinach.

Veronique mean with grapes.

People on these "cooking" shows and websites have no idea of cooking terms or the history of the dish. They have absolutely no idea what the meaning of a dish is.
 
  • #39
turbo-1 said:
Evo, most people have not had real corned beef. Most people have not had real salt pork or real smoked bacon or salted leeks or fresh (or fermented) apple cider.

All good stuff. It's been a while since you could go to a farm, hold a cup at the press and get some fresh cider.
Probably illegal now :rolleyes:

Maple syrups a good thing :smile:

It may be worse than you say, I doubt that a lot of people would recognize a cow if they saw one let alone parts of it.
 
  • #40
It may indeed be worse. Many people are absolutely clueless. Although most people could see a picture of a cow and think "cow", they are so divorced from reality and caught up in hype that they will willingly pay $$$$$ for inferior cuts of beef. The very best bang for the buck is blade steaks. Yeah, they've got a thin line of gristle down the center, but they are one of the most flavorful cuts of beef available, and CHEAP! Our typical weekend breakfast is rare blade steaks rubbed with salt and black pepper, quick-fried in butter, with a side of crispy fried potatoes (in olive oil) and maybe some toast made from home-made onion-rye bread.

If you haven't tried blade steaks, you're in for a treat. Sliced thin and fried very hot, they are an acceptable substitute for venison. There isn't another cut of beef that comes close, IMO. Another great little secret is to bake big salmon, trout, etc with their heads on. The jaw muscles hiding under the gill flaps are more delectable than sea scallops or lobster. They can trigger good-natured (or not) jostling amongst those who are "in the know".
 
  • #41
Evo said:
People on these "cooking" shows and websites have no idea of cooking terms or the history of the dish. They have absolutely no idea what the meaning of a dish is.

Whoa--I've got it! Take the food threads throughout PF history, throw in some science (thermodynamics, bio, chem, etc.) and let's start our own darn cooking show... PysicsForumsPhood is coming: watch out! :devil:
 
  • #42
mbrmbrg said:
Whoa--I've got it! Take the food threads throughout PF history, throw in some science (thermodynamics, bio, chem, etc.) and let's start our own darn cooking show... PysicsForumsPhood is coming: watch out! :devil:
Now that would be a great idea! I suggest we start the Geek Channel. We could have woodworking for geeks, masonry for geeks, etc... We would spend a lot of time discussing the project, alternatives to the project, probable outcomes, of course using lots of math and diagrams. Unfortunately each show would run out of time before any actual work could be started. :biggrin:
 
  • #43
Already posted: Astronuc and Zapper in the kitchen
http://img151.imageshack.us/img151/5835/cookies2dm3.jpg
 
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