Graphs with N Nodes: Proving Cliques and Anti-Cliques

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around proving a property of graphs related to cliques and anti-cliques, specifically that every graph with \( n \) nodes contains either a clique or an anti-clique with at least \( \frac{1}{2} \log_2 n \) nodes. Participants explore theoretical approaches, particularly through Ramsey's theory, and engage in clarifying the implications of certain mathematical results.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant defines a clique and an anti-clique in the context of a graph and poses a question about how to prove the stated property.
  • Another participant suggests applying Ramsey's theory and introduces the notation \( R(m,n) \) to discuss the conditions under which a graph contains either a \( m \)-clique or an \( n \)-independent set.
  • Some participants express confusion about the implications of Ramsey's theory, particularly regarding the values of \( R(n,n) \) and its relationship to the proof.
  • Concerns are raised about specific cases, such as graphs with 3 nodes, questioning whether they meet the criteria of having cliques or anti-cliques of the required size.
  • Further mathematical results are mentioned, including an inequality involving binomial coefficients, which some participants believe is relevant to the proof.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the proof strategy or the implications of Ramsey's theory. There are multiple competing views on how to approach the problem, and some participants express uncertainty about the correctness of their interpretations and calculations.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight potential limitations in their understanding of Ramsey's theory and the specific mathematical steps required to connect it to the original problem statement. There is also mention of vacuous truths in specific cases, indicating a need for careful consideration of definitions and conditions.

mathmari
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Hey! :o

Let $G$ be a graph. A clique in $G$ is a subgraph in which every two nodes are connected by an edge. An anti-clique, also called an independent set, is a subgraph in which every two nodes are not connected by an edge. Show that every graph with $n$ nodes contains either a clique or an anti-clique with at least $\frac{1}{2} \log_2 n$ nodes.

Could you give me some hints how we could show this?? (Wondering)
 
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Apply Ramsey's theory. Let $R(m,n)$ be the least integer $s$ where a graph $G$ with $s$ vertices contain either a $m$-clique or an $n$-independent set.

Then, use the properties of $R(\cdot, \cdot)$ to show that $R(n,n) \leq 2^{2n}$.
 
magneto said:
Apply Ramsey's theory. Let $R(m,n)$ be the least integer $s$ where a graph $G$ with $s$ vertices contain either a $m$-clique or an $n$-independent set.

Then, use the properties of $R(\cdot, \cdot)$ to show that $R(n,n) \leq 2^{2n}$.

Could you explain to me further what I have to do?? (Wondering) I got stuck right now...
 
When we have graphs with $3$ nodes:

View attachment 4021

doesn't the graphs have cliques or anti-cliques with at least $2$ nodes??

But $\frac{1}{2} \log_2 3=0.7924 \dots $. So have I done something wrong?? (Wondering)
 

Attachments

  • (Anti-)Clique.png
    (Anti-)Clique.png
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You want to use (or proof) the result:

\[
R(r,s) \leq \binom{r+s-2}{r-1}.
\]

In your example, $R(2,2) = 2$, in other words, any graph that has $2$ or more vertices, you are going to find a $2$-clique or $2$-independent set. But that's not what the actual statement you want to prove. In the case $\nu = 3$,
the statement in fact promises a $0$-clique or a $0$-independent set, which is vacuously true.
 
magneto said:
You want to use (or proof) the result:

\[
R(r,s) \leq \binom{r+s-2}{r-1}.
\]

In your example, $R(2,2) = 2$, in other words, any graph that has $2$ or more vertices, you are going to find a $2$-clique or $2$-independent set. But that's not what the actual statement you want to prove. In the case $\nu = 3$,
the statement in fact promises a $0$-clique or a $0$-independent set, which is vacuously true.

I got stuck right now... To show that every graph with $n$ nodes contains either a clique or an anti-clique with at least $\frac{1}{2} \log_2 n$ nodes why do we have to show that $R(n, n) \leq 2^{2n}$ ??

$$R(n, n) \leq \binom{n+n-2}{n-1}=\binom{2n-2}{n-1}=\frac{(2(n-1))!}{(n-1)!(n-1)!}$$ How could we continue?? (Wondering)
 
The equation follows from the definition of $R$ and the problem statement.

The inequality follows from the fact that, for $m \geq n$

\[
\binom mn < \sum_k \binom mk = 2^m.
\]
 

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