Gravitational Potential & Field: Doubts & Solutions

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the relationship between gravitational potential and gravitational field, particularly exploring scenarios where gravitational potential may be zero while the gravitational field is non-zero. Participants delve into theoretical concepts, analogies, and interpretations related to gravitational behavior, especially in the context of the Earth's center.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants suggest that the center of the Earth could be a situation where gravitational potential is zero, but the gravitational field is non-zero.
  • Others argue that at the center of the Earth, both gravitational potential and gravitational field are zero, citing the negative derivative relationship between the two.
  • One participant emphasizes that gravitational potential is arbitrary and can be defined at different reference points, affecting its perceived value.
  • Another participant proposes that the gravitational potential at the center of the Earth is a negative value with a large magnitude, contrasting it with the conventionally defined zero potential at infinity.
  • Some participants draw analogies with magnetic fields to illustrate the concepts, discussing how balance and field strength can vary in different contexts.
  • There are differing views on whether gravitational fields exist at the center of the Earth, with some suggesting quantum fluctuations may play a role.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express multiple competing views regarding the gravitational potential and field at the center of the Earth, with no consensus reached on whether the gravitational field can be non-zero while the potential is zero.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference various definitions and conventions regarding gravitational potential, indicating that the discussion is influenced by differing assumptions about the nature of gravitational fields and potentials.

  • #61
Nugatory has explained it very well. When wikipedia says: "The stress–energy tensor is the source of the gravitational field in the Einstein field equations of general relativity, just as mass density is the source of such a field in Newtonian gravity." This is only a loose analogy. The two relationships are not meant to be taken as literally identical.

Edit: Also, on this page: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Einstein_field_equations They give a derivation of Newton's law of gravity from Einstein's field equations, under several limiting assumptions. So from looking at this derivation, you can see in what sense the stress-energy tensor in general relativity and the mass density in Newtonian gravity are similar.
 
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  • #62
DaleSpam said:
Yes, but I personally think that including other fictitious forces in gravity is more or less justified by the equivalence principle. However, since there isn't general agreement on the topic and since my justification is admittedly pretty sketchy I certainly don't push my viewpoint.

Hmm, I don't know much about Christofel symbols, but I was under the impression that fictitious forces in gravity are justified by the equivalence principle.

You say there isn't general agreement on this, so it would be interesting if you could please provide some references to those arguments.
 
  • #63
MikeGomez said:
Hmm, I don't know much about Christofel symbols, but I was under the impression that fictitious forces in gravity are justified by the equivalence principle.
If you have a curvilinear coordinate system and you parallel transport a vector then its components will change, not due to any change in the vector itself, but due to the curving of the coordinates. The Christoffel symbols capture that effect.

MikeGomez said:
You say there isn't general agreement on this, so it would be interesting if you could please provide some references to those arguments.
I think that MTW gives a good overview in "Gravitation". You should start around p 460-470 or so. Here is an online source: http://arxiv.org/abs/physics/0204044
 
  • #64
Thanks Dale.
 

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