Help with Density Operators: Peter Yu Seeks Assistance

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    Density Operators
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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around understanding the Density Operator in quantum mechanics, specifically referencing material from "Quantum Mechanics Demystified." Participants seek clarification on various aspects of density operators, including their mathematical formulation and conceptual interpretation.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Homework-related

Main Points Raised

  • Peter Yu expresses difficulty in understanding the Density Operator and requests assistance, referencing a specific page from a textbook.
  • Some participants discuss the mathematical operations involved in density operators, including the duality operation and the outer product of vectors.
  • One participant suggests that states should be understood as positive operators of unit trace rather than elements of a vector space, introducing the concepts of pure and mixed states.
  • Another participant proposes a practical exercise involving a simple case of a quantum state to help clarify the concept of density operators.
  • Peter Yu acknowledges understanding part of the material but continues to struggle with another section, prompting further questions about specific equations.
  • Responses include detailed explanations of the mathematical steps involved in deriving properties of density operators, including the use of orthogonality and polar forms of complex numbers.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the complexity of the Density Operator and the need for clarification, but multiple viewpoints and methods of explanation are presented without a consensus on the best approach to understanding it.

Contextual Notes

Some participants reference specific equations and concepts that may depend on prior knowledge of quantum mechanics, which could limit understanding for those less familiar with the subject.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be useful for students and individuals seeking to deepen their understanding of density operators in quantum mechanics, particularly those encountering challenges with the mathematical and conceptual aspects of the topic.

Peter Yu
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I have difficulty in understanding the Density Operator. Please see attached file. (From the Book " Quantum Mechanics Demystified Page 250)

Most grateful if someone could help!

Peter Yu
 
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I have difficulty in understanding the Density Operator. Please see attached file. (From the Book " Quantum Mechanics Demystified Page 250)

Most grateful if someone could help! Here is the attached file!

Peter Yu
 

Attachments

The duality operation transforms those ##c_i## into their conjugates. Do the outer product between the vector and its dual and you will get the result (remember that you have two sums, the expansion of the vector and the one of the dual, you have two sums and that's why you have two indices; when the values of the indices coincide, you get ##c_i## multiplied by its conjugate, i.e., the square modulus)
 
Its best understood the other way around. Forget what you have been told about states - they are not in general elements of a vector space - they are positive operators of unit trace. Operators of the form |u><u| are by definition called pure. The |u> can be mapped to a vector space so pure operators are the ones usually talked about. Operators of the form ∑pi |bi><bi| are called mixed. It can be shown all states are pure or mixed.

The Born rule using this definition of a state is, given an observable O, the expected value of an observation using O, E(O), when a system is in state P, is E(O) = Trace (PO).

Thanks
Bill
 
To complement aleazk's answer, try it for yourself. Consider the simple case
$$
| \psi \rangle = c_1 | u_1 \rangle + c_2 | u_2 \rangle
$$
Find ##\langle \psi |##, then calculate ##\rho = | \psi \rangle \langle \psi |##.
 
Hi All,
Thank you very much your all your help!
Now I understand the first part on the first page. But I still have difficulty on the second part on the second page of my attached file.
Thank again!
Peter Yu
 
Which part of that equation causes you problems? The first or the second equality, or both? Or is it the left-hand side you don't understand?
 
Hi DrClaude,
First of all many thanks for your kind assistance. I do not understand both side.
Regards,
Peter Yu
 
The first equality you can find by replacing ρ using the first equation you didn't understand. When first calculating ##\rho | u_j \rangle##, you will get a bunch of ##\langle u_i | u_j \rangle##, which by orthogonality of the basis states ##| u_i \rangle## will result in Kronecker deltas ##\delta_{ij}##. You will thus get ##c_i^* \langle u_i |## from ##\rho## and ##| u_j \rangle## on the left-hand side, resulting in
$$
c_i^* \langle u_i | u_j \rangle = c_i^* \delta_{ij} = c_j^*
$$
You then do the same with the bra ##\langle u_i |## applied to ##\rho##, giving you ##c_i##.

Tjhe second equality you get by rewriting the complex numbers ##c_i## and ##c_j^*## in polar form, as explained at the bottom of page 251.
 
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Hi All,
I got it now!
Thank you very much for your help!
Regards!
 
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