How Can a PhD Physicist Find Better Paying Jobs in North East England?

[GCarty]

As if things couldn't get any worse, the council will be ripping the house apart sometime in the next month to upgrade the heating! (And given how tightly packed the upstairs rooms in particular are with stuff, I don't see how we can cope at all!)

At least that's been canceled now, thank goodness!

(When the housing officers came on Monday to have a look at our situation, it probably helped a great deal that one of them himself had a 14-year old autistic son.)

 

[phylotree]

An apparent case people experience is after they could land on some kind of jobs, they would need work to do; so, if they are assigned with too many tasks, they'll be buried and complain that they are probably being ill-treated; but if they have nothing to do, they may become bored of their current jobs. Oh well, I have met an accountant who was asked to create a payment request in a single page of MS Word, and it took her the whole day to do just that.
In daily routine at the company, there are tasks/works we never want to do because they are dumb and boring but that only happens when we work for others.

 

[turbo]

As suggested earlier, GCarty, is there any way you can can telecommute so you can stay physically close, yet earn more money? One of my neighbors is a programmer who has lots of clients in the Boston area, yet he can stay in Maine for much of the time and do upgrades, etc from here. I wish his wife could do the same because my wife and I like them both and would love to have them as permanent neighbors, not part-timers. Some jobs are not amenable to telecommuting, but you may be able to work into a position that is. Good luck.

 

[mal4mac]

I have a 1st class Physics degree and a PhD, but I'm only earning £18,900 per year in my current computer programming job even though I've been in the job for 4 years (possible due to the company having cash flow problems last year).

Does anyone know how I could find better paid work in North East England, preferably more appropriate to my academic background? I don't want to relocate unless I have absolutely no alternative.

For more information, you can view my CV at gcarty (dot) awardspace (dot) com (slash) cv (slash) CV (dot) html .

See if the local universities are offering any programming jobs. You should be able to (at least!) start on what you are earning now. Then there is an automatic increment each year, and maybe a bonus as well (plus generous final salary pension...) With a PhD you might even be able to move onto the academic side of things, if you do research-oriented programming.
Try searching jobs.ac.uk. Don't be put off by "fixed term contract", once you are in and if you do your job(!), then permanent contracts usually follow.

 

[GCarty]

Three questions I'd like to ask:

1. What could I do in my spare time after work that could improve my earning potential?
2. If I was able to relocate in the future, what opportunities could I as a physics PhD pursue that would give me a good chance of £50k+/year earnings? (I know about quantitative finance, but any others?)
3. What should I do if my parents start humiliating me by pointing to non-graduates on salaries far higher than my own? (Such as the Tyne and Wear Metro drivers going on strike tomorrow, who are on £32k/year, or £37k/year if they do overtime...)

 

[StatGuy2000]

Three questions I'd like to ask:

1. What could I do in my spare time after work that could improve my earning potential?
2. If I was able to relocate in the future, what opportunities could I as a physics PhD pursue that would give me a good chance of £50k+/year earnings? (I know about quantitative finance, but any others?)
3. What should I do if my parents start humiliating me by pointing to non-graduates on salaries far higher than my own? (Such as the Tyne and Wear Metro drivers going on strike tomorrow, who are on £32k/year, or £37k/year if they do overtime...)

Here are my answers to your question (you can take these answers for what they are worth):

(1) Since you already have skills as a programmer as well as a physics PhD (in the area of simulations), I would suggest expanding your portfolio in programming into numerical simulations and the like. Another thing in your spare time that could improve your earning potential would be to learn more about statistics or machine learning, as data mining and analytics are increasingly in demand.

(2) You have already pointed out quantitative finance. I'm only vaguely aware of the economic situation in the UK apart from what I have read in the Economist, but some as I've pointed out in (1), data mining/business analytics may be one lucrative area you could pursue. You could also try your hand at statistical programming for pharmaceutical companies or contractors.

(3) I would ignore anything your parents say regarding salaries of others, as it is none of their concern what you earn so long as you are gainfully employed in an area that utilizes your skills, and you earn the salary that makes you feel good. I don't want to speak ill of other's parents or families, but it seems to me that your parents come across (at least from your description of them) as incredibly selfish, without any regards to your happiness. If that is the case (and I apologize in advance if I'm mistaken), then it is best to keep as much of an emotional distance between them as possible, even while living with them. You are an adult, and should take stock in and be proud of your own achievements, and do not feel that you owe anyone anything for them.

 

[GCarty]

(1) Since you already have skills as a programmer as well as a physics PhD (in the area of simulations), I would suggest expanding your portfolio in programming into numerical simulations and the like. Another thing in your spare time that could improve your earning potential would be to learn more about statistics or machine learning, as data mining and analytics are increasingly in demand.

(2) You have already pointed out quantitative finance. I'm only vaguely aware of the economic situation in the UK apart from what I have read in the Economist, but some as I've pointed out in (1), data mining/business analytics may be one lucrative area you could pursue. You could also try your hand at statistical programming for pharmaceutical companies or contractors.

Data mining sounds interesting -- where would you recommend I look if I was interested in finding out more info? Also, what kind of statistics stuff would you recommend I look at? I currently only know the basics -- mean, variance and standard deviation; binomial, Poisson and normal distributions; linear regression...

(3) I would ignore anything your parents say regarding salaries of others, as it is none of their concern what you earn so long as you are gainfully employed in an area that utilizes your skills, and you earn the salary that makes you feel good.

I don't really feel that my current position fully uses my skills -- the only sort-of-higher maths I use is a bit of vector algebra...

I don't want to speak ill of other's parents or families, but it seems to me that your parents come across (at least from your description of them) as incredibly selfish, without any regards to your happiness.

What makes you say that? As I've already mentioned, my mother is living a total life of hell! (I'm not so bothered about my father, as his problems are largely self-inflicted, unlike my mother's.) What would you suggest I do about my mother's two main problems that currently prevent me from getting my own place? (Namely, her need for a driver to take her to buy groceries, and her extreme isolation and loneliness.)

The fact that at least two people here (correct me if I'm wrong) have clutched at straws by suggesting "telecommuting" suggests that inability to relocate would be a HUGE drag on my prospects...

 

[StatGuy2000]

Data mining sounds interesting -- where would you recommend I look if I was interested in finding out more info? Also, what kind of statistics stuff would you recomment I look at? I currently only know the basics -- mean, variance and standard deviation; binomial, Poisson and normal distributions; linear regression...

Here is a link with a list of various books dealing with data mining, recommended by experts.

http://www.albionresearch.com/books/data_mining.php

In addition, if you are willing to learn more about applied statistics, I would further recommend these books:

The R Book, by Michael J. Crawley (this is a book that gives an introduction to the R programming language, frequently used by statisticians)

Modern Applied Statistics with S-plus, by Venables & Ripley (the applied stats textbook I used, using the S-plus programming language, which is practically identical to R)

There are many other books and online references on statistics, too many to list (you can find many through a quick Google search); if I think of other good books, I'll pass it along to you.

What makes you say that? As I've already mentioned, my mother is living a total life of hell! (I'm not so bothered about my father, as his problems are largely self-inflicted, unlike my mother's...)

I apologize if I offended you in any way. I do not know your parents, and it was unfair of me to judge their situation without being in your shoes. It's just that you were concerned about your parents humiliating you, and I just cannot imagine my parents ever doing this to me (I have a very warm, close relationship with my parents, so I am clearly biased on this issue).

My point earlier (which I admit I did not convey in the best manner) was that you shouldn't be too concerned about what your parents say about your salary or your work, and that you should take stock in your achievements, and in what you can achieve in the future.

 

[GCarty]

Another question -- why does the village next to mine seem to have had so many posh £200k+ houses built there recently? There must be some well-paid local jobs, or they'd never be able to sell such houses!

 

[turbo]

Another question -- why does the village next to mine seem to have had so many posh £200k+ houses built there recently? There must be some well-paid local jobs, or they'd never be able to sell such houses!

Not necessarily. Many years ago, my wife and I bought a big house in a nice neighborhood. I was planning to move into consulting work and I wanted her to have a nice place in a "safe" neighborhood with close neighbors, so I could feel that she was secure when I was half a country away for several days or a week at a time. Virtually everybody in that neighborhood were dual-income families.

Most had no kids (at least for a long time), so it was a nice quiet place to live. Our neighbors included the chief accountant for the local paper mill, senior engineer in another paper mill, a couple of tenured school-teachers, the owner of a trucking company, the local postmaster, commercial real-estate appraiser, the senior credit manager for the local bank, and others.

Some of those jobs were local, and some of them (mine, especially) required lots of travel. People don't always live near their work. In the US, many people with access to public transportation move out of inner cities and buy places in the suburbs and put up with the commute. If you study the growth in the population of southern Maine, you would find that many of the "new" people commute to Boston. This has been enhanced by the implementation of the "Down-Easter program by AMTRAK. People can read, make notes, and work on their laptops while riding. Lots of impressive houses in that area, but on Boston salaries they are relatively affordable.

 

[GCarty]

Eh, by "local" I meant "within about 50 miles or so" (surely greater distances than this wouldn't be practical to commute?)

 

[turbo]

Eh, by "local" I meant "within about 50 miles or so" (surely greater distances than this wouldn't be practical to commute?)

That depends on the availability of public transport. Belfast, Maine is not really "local" to Boston MA, but AMTRAK makes it practical.

 

[meldraft]

In the UK, London to Cambridge or Oxford is also a very frequent choice for telecommuting.

 

[mdxyz]

I think your real problem is the personal situation between you and your parents, and this isn't really something that a physics board can or should attempt to solve.

From a personal perspective, I think you need to move out. Your parents are not going to die without you. The state will provide for their basic needs, and your presence is not really alleviating their health problems. What it is doing is destroying your own life. You are tied in a part of the country that there are basically no high tech jobs, living your life for your parents who apparently make fun of how little you earn! There comes a point where this is no longer your responsibility, especially if you have already given them the last decade and a half.

Obvious next step is to apply for IT jobs in the South East.

 

[GCarty]

You are tied in a part of the country that there are basically no high tech jobs, living your life for your parents who apparently make fun of how little you earn!

Saying that is making me regret my choice of degree! I basically went into physics because physics and maths were my best school subjects, and because I was told (by my A-level physics teacher) that engineering was undervalued in Britain. Why was I so dumb not to ask if there'd be a well-paid local job at the end of it?

I started university at 16 (which no doubt meant I was immature then) but I must have already had an inkling by 20 -- one reason I had for doing a PhD is that I thought that a few extra years may have made my parents more open to my leaving home (it didn't -- they still didn't think I could manage my own place...)

 

[Locrian]

I started university at 16 (which no doubt meant I was immature then) but I must have already had an inkling by 20 -- one reason I had for doing a PhD is that I thought that a few extra years may have made my parents more open to my leaving home (it didn't -- they still didn't think I could manage my own place...)

Shoulda proved them wrong.

 

[StatGuy2000]

Saying that is making me regret my choice of degree! I basically went into physics because physics and maths were my best school subjects, and because I was told (by my A-level physics teacher) that engineering was undervalued in Britain. Why was I so dumb not to ask if there'd be a well-paid local job at the end of it?

I started university at 16 (which no doubt meant I was immature then) but I must have already had an inkling by 20 -- one reason I had for doing a PhD is that I thought that a few extra years may have made my parents more open to my leaving home (it didn't -- they still didn't think I could manage my own place...)

In my opinion, going back and regretting the choices you made about your degree is pointless. At this point, I can only repeat what others have said in telling you that staying with your parents is not doing you (or for that matter them) any good. I think the best thing you can do for yourself is to move out, and then find employment which is higher-paying or more fulfilling. If you really do want to stay with your family, then seeking a telecommuting position is another option to consider.

And frankly, you should stop doubting whether you will be able to make it on your own. Your are a grown man, and any healthy adult that does not suffer a physical disability has the capacity and ability to live on their own.

 

[Windowmaker]

Don't go into physics. if you like the subject go into engineering, where you can feed yourself.

 

[mdxyz]

Saying that is making me regret my choice of degree! I basically went into physics because physics and maths were my best school subjects, and because I was told (by my A-level physics teacher) that engineering was undervalued in Britain. Why was I so dumb not to ask if there'd be a well-paid local job at the end of it?

I didn't say there were no well-paying physics-related jobs, I said there were no well-paying physics jobs in the North East. There is very little of anything in the North East, but especially high tech and professional stuff, largely because professionals don't want to live in places like Hull. It would not be dramatically different in engineering, though finance is even more London-centric than everything else, so maybe a little.

That said, you'd be earning a lot more than £18k just by becoming a physics teacher at a secondary school, and that doesn't require a PhD and isn't too sensitive to location. You've undersold yourself quite a lot here, I guess because your company realizes you are going to stay no matter what.

I started university at 16 (which no doubt meant I was immature then) but I must have already had an inkling by 20 -- one reason I had for doing a PhD is that I thought that a few extra years may have made my parents more open to my leaving home (it didn't -- they still didn't think I could manage my own place...)

At 22, let alone at 32, you do not need your parents' permission to move out. This is a much much bigger problem you have than anything to do with what subject you studied or your career. If you want to stay with them at your own expense out of kindness, and that is your free choice, then that is one thing. But you are at a point in your life where if you don't want to do that, you have to just tell them you are leaving, and then leave.

 

[GCarty]

That said, you'd be earning a lot more than £18k just by becoming a physics teacher at a secondary school, and that doesn't require a PhD and isn't too sensitive to location.

I don't think I'm teacher material -- in fact one of my work mates actually tried teaching (maths) for a year, but couldn't stand it.

At 22, let alone at 32, you do not need your parents' permission to move out.

"Permission" isn't really the appropriate word to use -- it's more a case of not wanting to add to my mother's already considerable worries.

Before my dad had his brain haemorrhage, I got the impression that (I have a fair bit of money in the bank, mostly inherited from my grandparents) my mother wanted me to wait until I had enough money to buy a house outright, so that I would have no mortgage worries to trouble them with. After January though, the suggestion turned more towards the idea that I should buy a house for the family as a whole. I printed a list of all the houses in my price range in the nearest town (I wanted something in return for my money, namely not being needed to drive them to shops so that I could get my own place later on -- is this unreasonable?), but she rejected every single one of them (there were about 60 in my list) as "too small".

Of course space would be less of an issue if I was buying a house for them alone, while renting a place for myself somewhere else, but I have my suspicions that if I suggested that, my parents would claim that they couldn't afford to maintain a house if I wasn't living with them, even if I bought it outright!

How do I improve my own life without betraying my mother?

 

[mdxyz]

Stop thinking that having a life of your own is "betraying" other people. It sounds like she is taking advantage of you, frankly.

 

[ThinkToday]

After January though, the suggestion turned more towards the idea that I should buy a house for the family as a whole. I printed a list of all the houses in my price range in the nearest town (I wanted something in return for my money, namely not being needed to drive them to shops so that I could get my own place later on -- is this unreasonable?), but she rejected every single one of them (there were about 60 in my list) as "too small".

While you will always be your parents "child', you are an adult. You need to make your own decisions. If you choose to take care of your parents as they age, which is a good thing, you need to do it within YOUR frame of reference. Personally, there is no way in hell I would buy a house and have my parents move in with me. I can't imagine having my in-laws or parents living with me now. Assuming you are single, what do you think finding a future date/spouse would be like, knowing they'll be in the same house with your parents? IMO, based on your mom shooting down your house selections, do you really think your mother won't try to rule the roost when you have a spouse? Not a good scenario. I don't know what things are like where you are, but I'd find a nice apartment in an age appropriate (senior) community for them. They would have friends with common interests, music, social activity, etc.. You should become an occasional VISITOR. Move the heck away enough they won't be in your life every day trying to "guide" you in things they should stay out of.

Lastly, unless you think you're going to stay where you are a long time, I'd pass on buying a house. I bought my first house after I got married and moved a few times. It's a two person choice, and what you choose now may not work later. Find a nice apartment with other young people around, hit the social circle, and enjoy life. Visit your parents, but don't mix them up in your life too much.

 

[GCarty]

I didn't say there were no well-paying physics-related jobs, I said there were no well-paying physics jobs in the North East. There is very little of anything in the North East, but especially high tech and professional stuff, largely because professionals don't want to live in places like Hull. It would not be dramatically different in engineering, though finance is even more London-centric than everything else, so maybe a little.

Is the North-South divide severe enough (in your view) that it would be easier to get a £50k/year job in the South than a £30k/year job in the North (where "North" means anywhere north of Leicester, not just the Tyne-Tees region)?

 

[Devils]

Before my dad had his brain haemorrhage, I got the impression that (I have a fair bit of money in the bank, mostly inherited from my grandparents) my mother wanted me to wait until I had enough money to buy a house outright

I have a little knowledge of psychology. You need to see a registered psychologist, and go through these issues, have a talk about cognitive behavioural therapy.

- you sound like you have a very beta-male personality; you don't owe your parents anything after 21
- you are being a "white knight" solving others problems; listen to your language, you have empathy & identify with you parents; you need to learn to stand back and put this in perspective
- you can't solve others problems without looking after yourself first; look at your quote above from the perspective of an independent observer, asking for your mother's permission to buy your house!, it just appears odd
- the best present you could give your parents is get married & give them grandkids; you seem to have wandered down some track you have made for yourself with no plan at all
- starting this thread about under-employment, but ending up talking about your real problem tells me something too; could you have clinical depression or dysthemia without knowing it? Talk to a psychologist.

 

[AnTiFreeze3]

Carthy, disregard Devils' unjustified claims. I think he likes playing doctor.

 

[GCarty]

Solving my family problems

- you sound like you have a very beta-male personality; you don't owe your parents anything after 21
- you can't solve others problems without looking after yourself first; look at your quote above from the perspective of an independent observer, asking for your mother's permission to buy your house!, it just appears odd

Well they have let me live with them for next-to-nothing (I've often offered to make a bigger financial contribution to their household, only to be turned down flat every time). And since most of the money is what I inherited from my grandparents rather than what I earned through work, I feel like it isn't truly my money (it's probably only in my bank accounts because my parents are on means-tested benefits).

My predicament since January is that I'm now the only driver in a household located in a car-dependent area. I wanted to buy my parents a house in Peterlee so that they'd be within walking distance of decent shops (thus freeing me to move away without having any more responsibility to them), but as previously mentioned, she turned down every single one of 60 houses I listed as "too small". I never intended to stay with them long-term, rather I saw it as a way in which I could leave home with my honour still intact.

- the best present you could give your parents is get married & give them grandkids; you seem to have wandered down some track you have made for yourself with no plan at all

I can't imagine ever having children as the thought of having an autistic child like my sister fills me with terror. (And I feel like she's already a sword of Damocles hanging over me -- won't I have to care for her once my mother is no longer able to?)

I have Asperger syndrome myself, and know that there is a significant genetic component to autistic-spectrum disorders.

Perhaps adopting a child could be an idea, when the time comes?

 

[GCarty]

Personally, there is no way in hell I would buy a house and have my parents move in with me.

Lastly, unless you think you're going to stay where you are a long time, I'd pass on buying a house.

That wasn't really my plan -- it was rather to buy my mother a house in a non-car-dependent location so that she wouldn't need me to take her for groceries any more (and so that she could possibly find some opportunities to socialize -- she currently has no friends). This would allow me to move out (most likely to a rented flat) without being consumed with guilt about "abandoning" her, and without being chained to the North-East by her grocery shopping needs (also an important point, given the North-South divide in jobs that some others here have alluded to).

Assuming you are single, what do you think finding a future date/spouse would be like, knowing they'll be in the same house with your parents?

Bloody impossible, especially given my sister! One of the greatest fears in my life is that I'll never get to experience the ecstasy of having a naked woman in my arms!

IMO, based on your mom shooting down your house selections, do you really think your mother won't try to rule the roost when you have a spouse?

Good point, although given the sheer volume of things that she bought for my sister and I, she may have had a point about the houses within my budget being too small. (Your use of the word "mom" tells me you're North American, and houses in England are generally considerably smaller than in the US or Canada -- not surprising given that England's pop. density is comparable to Japan's.)

The amount of stuff also makes me think that for a place of my own, I'd want a 2 bed flat (although once moved, I would be able get rid of a lot of the excess stuff -- by car boot sale or Ebay -- without hurting my mother's feelings).

 

[Locrian]

Carthy, disregard Devils' unjustified claims. I think he likes playing doctor.

Well, GCarty has spent most of the thread playing patient, so it seems a reasonable response to me.

 

[StatGuy2000]

That wasn't really my plan -- it was rather to buy my mother a house in a non-car-dependent location so that she wouldn't need me to take her for groceries any more (and so that she could possibly find some opportunities to socialize -- she currently has no friends). This would allow me to move out (most likely to a rented flat) without being consumed with guilt about "abandoning" her, and without being chained to the North-East by her grocery shopping needs (also an important point, given the North-South divide in jobs that some others here have alluded to).
Bloody impossible, especially given my sister! One of the greatest fears in my life is that I'll never get to experience the ecstasy of having a naked woman in my arms!
Good point, although given the sheer volume of things that she bought for my sister and I, she may have had a point about the houses within my budget being too small. (Your use of the word "mom" tells me you're North American, and houses in England are generally considerably smaller than in the US or Canada -- not surprising given that England's pop. density is comparable to Japan's.)

The amount of stuff also makes me think that for a place of my own, I'd want a 2 bed flat (although once moved, I would be able get rid of a lot of the excess stuff -- by car boot sale or Ebay -- without hurting my mother's feelings).

Let me ask you something -- you were mentioning the amount of stuff that your parents (or more specifically, your mother) bought for you and your sister, and thus the house being too small. Do you actually need any of these items? You had already mentioned selling them on Ebay or car boot sale -- why not proceed to sell them right now, and then proceed to buy the house for your mother at a price you can afford. If the items are sold off, then that should open up the space that your mother is talking about. Then proceed to buy the house without her permission!

As a suggestion, make an ultimatum to your parents -- either move to the new house you bought for them (in a location where a car is not required), or stay in her current home and get NO help from you whatsoever.

As for your sister, just how severe is her autism? Some autistics can (with support) live independent lives. Assuming that her condition is severe, is it not possible for her to be placed in an institution where she can be given round-the-clock care by professionals (thus taking the burden off of you and your parents)? I'm sure those places are found in the UK.

 

[GCarty]

How to get away from my family?

Let me ask you something -- you were mentioning the amount of stuff that your parents (or more specifically, your mother) bought for you and your sister, and thus the house being too small. Do you actually need any of these items?

A few months back I tried to get rid of some of my carved wooden animals (I don't want rid of all of them, but I only want about half as many as I currently had) but my mother stopped me. I also wouldn't want to get rid of DVDs that I hadn't even watched, as that would hurt my mother's feeling even more. (Some of the things are no doubt bought for me in a vain attempt to lure me off my computer...)

I want my own place anyway (and moving away would free up far more space than just getting rid of some of my things). The main problem is plucking up the courage to tell my mother that I'm serious to move away (because she craves my company so much as I'm the only halfway-sane person she sees most days).

As a suggestion, make an ultimatum to your parents -- either move to the new house you bought for them (in a location where a car is not required), or stay in her current home and get NO help from you whatsoever.

I was already thinking on similar lines for after I moved away, with the additional threat that if she couldn't make her mind up on a house, I'd use the money to buy somewhere for myself instead (after all, it could come in very useful were I to move Down South).

As for your sister, just how severe is her autism? Some autistics can (with support) live independent lives. Assuming that her condition is severe, is it not possible for her to be placed in an institution where she can be given round-the-clock care by professionals (thus taking the burden off of you and your parents)? I'm sure those places are found in the UK.

She's not so severe that she can't talk (as is the case with some autistics) but "eternal 7-year-old" would be a good first-order approximation of her mental capabilities. My mother isn't keen at all about her living in an institution though, due to fears that she'd be abused and wouldn't be able to tell anyone what was happening. My mother has often said that if she won the lottery, she'd let me have all the winnings on condition that I promised to look after my sister...