How did LIGO estimate the distance of the black holes?

Click For Summary
SUMMARY

The LIGO collaboration successfully estimated the distance and masses of merging black holes using gravitational wave signals. The masses are derived from the frequency changes of the wave, while the distance is determined from the amplitude of the signal. The technique involves applying Kepler's law, specifically the formula T² = (4π²/GM)a³, where T is the orbital period, G is the gravitational constant, M is the total mass, and a is the separation. The chirp mass, denoted as ##\mathscr{M}##, plays a crucial role in these calculations, as detailed in the paper by C. Messenger et al. (2014).

PREREQUISITES
  • Understanding of gravitational waves and their properties
  • Familiarity with Kepler's laws of planetary motion
  • Basic knowledge of wave physics, including frequency and amplitude
  • Ability to interpret scientific papers in astrophysics
NEXT STEPS
  • Study the derivation and implications of Kepler's law in astrophysical contexts
  • Learn about gravitational wave detection techniques used by LIGO
  • Explore the concept of chirp mass and its significance in binary systems
  • Read the paper "Detection of GW150914" by C. Messenger et al. for detailed methodologies
USEFUL FOR

Astronomy students, astrophysicists, and researchers interested in gravitational wave astronomy and black hole physics will benefit from this discussion.

JK423
Gold Member
Messages
394
Reaction score
7
As we all know, the LIGO collaboration published a paper recently on the first direct observation of a binary merging black hole system. From the observed signal, they were able to infer the black holes' masses and their distance from Earth.

However, the fact that they can estimate masses and distance is completely non-intuitive to me. To my mind, the same signal could have been produced by two black holes that are much closer to us but have smaller masses.
What is it that singles out the particular black hole configuration they reported? Does anyone have any intuition on that?
 
Physics news on Phys.org
The masses are inferred from the frequency of the wave and how it changes, the distance is inferred from the amplitude.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: JK423
That makes sense! Thanks a lot
 
Orodruin said:
The masses are inferred from the frequency of the wave and how it changes, the distance is inferred from the amplitude.
Do you know the specific formula they were using to count the distance. I am in high school and the physics course that i am having has only given me the basic equation of Waves, which is velocity = Hz x wavelength.
 
See https://dcc.ligo.org/public/0122/P150914/014/LIGO-P150914_Detection_of_GW150914.pdf

I'm not sure if they used a numerical simulation to get the "Keplerian effective black hole separation" or whether they just deduced that from the frequency of the chirp using Newton's laws. It sounds like it might be the later, but it wasn't too clear to me from reading the paper. There is a formula in the paper for the mass calculation of the pair, though. What's calculated is called the "chirp mass".
 
Let me expand my previous response in a bit more detail. Kepler's law is:

$$T^2 = \frac{4 \pi^2}{GM} a^3$$

where T is the orbital period, G is the gravitational constant, M is the mass (for a two body Newtonian system, the total mass) and a is the separation. So basically I'm assuming that when they calculate the ""Keplerian effective black hole separation", they are using Kepler's law to do it, just from the name they used. To calculate a, they would need T and M. The former they can get from 1/f, f being the frequency of the chirp, and they can estimate M from ##\mathscr{M}##, the chirp mass. I should add that ##\mathscr{M}## is new to me, but they do give an explanation and a literature reference in the paper describing it's calculation.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: Inwicta
pervect said:
Let me expand my previous response in a bit more detail. Kepler's law is:

$$T^2 = \frac{4 \pi^2}{GM} a^3$$

where T is the orbital period, G is the gravitational constant, M is the mass (for a two body Newtonian system, the total mass) and a is the separation. So basically I'm assuming that when they calculate the ""Keplerian effective black hole separation", they are using Kepler's law to do it, just from the name they used. To calculate a, they would need T and M. The former they can get from 1/f, f being the frequency of the chirp, and they can estimate M from ##\mathscr{M}##, the chirp mass. I should add that ##\mathscr{M}## is new to me, but they do give an explanation and a literature reference in the paper describing it's calculation.
Thank you!
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 13 ·
Replies
13
Views
2K
  • · Replies 32 ·
2
Replies
32
Views
3K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 12 ·
Replies
12
Views
2K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
2K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 37 ·
2
Replies
37
Views
6K