How do you take the derivative of a Wronskian?

  • Context: Graduate 
  • Thread starter Thread starter musemonkey
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Derivative Wronskian
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on the process of taking the derivative of the Wronskian, which is the determinant of a matrix of functions. Participants explore theoretical aspects and seek clarification on the methodology involved in differentiating the Wronskian specifically, as well as the general principles of differentiating determinants of matrices of functions.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • Genya questions how to take the derivative of the Wronskian and references a remark suggesting that the derivative is the determinant of a sum of matrices formed by differentiating one row of the Wronskian.
  • Another participant elaborates on the properties of determinants, explaining that the derivative involves a sum of products derived from the original determinant, where each product corresponds to differentiating one element of the matrix.
  • There is a query about proving the derivative for the case of n=2, with a specific formula provided for that case, and a suggestion that induction might be a method to extend the proof.
  • A further contribution mentions the definition of the determinant by permutations and suggests that differentiating this definition could lead to the desired result.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express various viewpoints on the methodology for differentiating the Wronskian, with no consensus reached on a definitive proof or approach. The discussion remains open with multiple perspectives on how to proceed with the proof.

Contextual Notes

Some participants reference the complexity of the determinant's definition and the potential use of induction, indicating that there may be unresolved mathematical steps or assumptions in their reasoning.

musemonkey
Messages
23
Reaction score
0
In general, the question is how do you take the derivative of the determinant of a matrix of functions, but more specifically how does one do this for a Wronskian?

I've read a remark that seemed to say that the derivative for an nth order Wronskian is the determinant of a sum of n matrices, each of which is made by differentiating one row of the Wronskian. Is that right?

In linear algebra texts derivatives of matrices of functions are discussed but it's been so long that the language of the latter chapters of those texts is no longer accessible to me. Is there a way to understand this without adjoints etc?

Thank you,
Genya
 
Physics news on Phys.org
musemonkey said:
I've read a remark that seemed to say that the derivative for an nth order Wronskian is the determinant of a sum of n matrices, each of which is made by differentiating one row of the Wronskian. Is that right?

A determinant of a matrix NxN is a sum of N! products of N matrix elements. Each product contains exactly one element from each row and each column, if you draw it on the matrix it looks like 'lightning'. So the determinant is the sum of all possible 'lightnings'. When you differentiate that sum, the result is the sum of the derivatives of each 'lightnings'. The derivative of each lightning, by product rule, is sum of N products, in each product only one element of the lightning is differentiated.

That's why the derivative of the determinant is a sum of N determinants of N matrices, each matrix obtained from the original one by differentiating only one row (or column if u prefer to work with the columns). The one differentiated row corresponds to only one element differentiated in each lightning.
 
so how do you prove that? it's not hard to prove for n=2 that the derivative of the wronskian

(det(f,g))'(t) = det(f'(t),g(t)) + det(f(t),g'(t))

but how to go on from here? it smells a bit of induction... but then again it doesn't seem to be the best way.
 
I think to prove it they make use of the definition of determinant by permutation (can't recall it exactly). The definition is something like this

det(A)=[tex]\sum (-1)^\sigma a_{1i_1} a_{2i_2} ... a_{ni_n}[/tex]

where the sum is over all permutation and [tex]\sigma[/tex] may be related to odd or even permutation (can't remember).

If we differentiate det(A) then I think we should be able to obtain the result.
 

Similar threads

Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
3K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
3K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
7K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
2K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
3K
  • · Replies 18 ·
Replies
18
Views
3K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
3K