How to Solve a Second Order Differential Equation with Given Initial Conditions?

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    2nd order Diff eq
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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around solving second-order differential equations with given initial conditions and the distinction between initial value problems and boundary value problems. Participants explore methods for finding solutions and clarify concepts related to the application of initial and boundary conditions.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant attempts to solve the equation 100Y"-729y=0 and expresses confusion regarding the correct formulation of the characteristic equation.
  • Another participant corrects the formulation of the characteristic equation, stating it should be 100r^2-729=0.
  • A participant inquires about solving a differential equation with initial conditions at two different points, suggesting a need for clarification on terminology.
  • Discussion arises about the distinction between initial value problems and boundary value problems, with one participant emphasizing that the existence and uniqueness theorem applies differently to these types of problems.
  • Another participant argues that a boundary value problem requires initial conditions for at least one derivative, while also asserting that the given problem is valid as an ordinary differential equation.
  • Further elaboration on the boundary value problem includes a specific example and the steps to derive constants from the boundary conditions.
  • One participant provides a detailed breakdown of how to manipulate equations to find constants A and B in the context of boundary conditions.
  • Concerns are raised about the feasibility of satisfying certain boundary conditions with the general solution of a differential equation.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the nature of the problem being discussed, with some agreeing on the validity of the ordinary differential equation while others emphasize the need for clarity on initial versus boundary conditions. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the implications of these distinctions.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight the importance of correctly identifying the type of problem (initial value vs. boundary value) and the implications this has on the methods used to solve the equations. There are also unresolved mathematical steps and assumptions regarding the application of conditions.

Dimedrol
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Ok, so i tried to solve this problem:
Find y as a function of t if:
100Y"-729y=0; y(0)=6, y'(0)=1
this is what i did so far:
100r^2-729r=0
r(100r-729)=0
r=0, r=729/100

y(x)=C1+C2*e^((729/100)*t)
y'(x)=C1+729/100C2*e^((729/100)t)

am I on the correct track? After I substitute the initial condition to find C1 and C2, the answer is not correct.
Any help would be appreciated.
 
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100Y"-729y=0 wouldn't give you 100r^2-729r=0
it would give you 100r^2-729=0
 
OH man how could I have missed that,
thanks GrowlEdit: To make Crowl, oops..., Growl happy, I am changing the last word of my original post from Crowl to Growl.
Sorry Growl,

Oh guy's: what is the function with the initial condition involve values at two points? Like y"-12y'+32y=0; y(0)=6 and y(1)=2
 
Last edited:
it's GROWL GROWL! DAMN IT! :devil: :devil: :devil:
 
dimedrol, it's exactly the same method. You solve for x2 - 12x + 32 = 0, find the corresponding solution to your differential equation, and you should end up with two constants of integration.

So, for example, you would find that x= 4 or 8. So y=Ae8t + Be4t

But y(0) = 6, so A+B=6 y(1)=2, so Ae8+Be4=2

Since the e to the power terms are just constants, you can solve easily for A and B
 
By the way, a problem with y given at two different points is not an "initial value"; it is a "boundary value" problem. The distinction is important. The "existence and uniqueness" theorem for initial value problems does not hold for boundary value problems.
 
However, I do believe in order for it to be a boundary value problem it would require ICs for at least one of its subsequent derivatives. As stated, having two IC for the original function would require you to use just one to solve the given problem.
 
winwizard3k said:
However, I do believe in order for it to be a boundary value problem it would require ICs for at least one of its subsequent derivatives. As stated, having two IC for the original function would require you to use just one to solve the given problem.

?? Perhaps you are thinking of partial differential equations of physics where, typically, we have boundary value conditions on x, the "space" variable, and initial conditions on t, the "time" variable.

The problem given here is an ordinary differential equation in the single variable, x. The problem given, y"-12y'+32y=0; y(0)=6 and y(1)=2, is perfecty valid. The "characteristic equation" is, as Office Shredder said,
r2- 12r+ 32= (r- 4)(r- 8)= 0 which has roots 4 and 8. The general solution to the equation is y= Ce4t+ De8t. The boundary conditions give us y(0)= C+ D= 6, y(1)= Ce4+ De8= 2. From the first equation, D= 6-C. Replace D by 6- C in the second equation to get Ce4+6e8- Ce8= 2.
C(e4-e8)= 2- 6e8 so that
C= \frac{2- 6e^8}{e^4- e^8}.
D= 6- C= 6-\frac{2- 6e^8}{e^4- e^8}.

My point before was that the simple boundary value problem
y"+ y= 0, y(0)= 0, y(\pi)= 1, even though the differential equation has general solution y= C cos(x)+ D sin(x), we cannot satisfy the boundary conditions: y(0)= C= 0 but y(\pi)= -C= 1.
 

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