Inertial vs non inertial frames

  • Context: High School 
  • Thread starter Thread starter rudransh verma
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Frames Inertial
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the classification of inertial and non-inertial frames of reference, particularly in relation to the Earth. Participants explore the conditions under which a frame is considered inertial, the implications of acceleration, and the effects of Earth's rotation on this classification.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests that a frame is inertial if a particle within it is not accelerating, raising questions about the implications of net force being zero.
  • Another participant argues that the Earth cannot be considered an inertial frame due to its rotation, although they acknowledge that it can be treated as such for certain approximations.
  • A later reply emphasizes the context-dependent nature of treating the Earth as inertial or non-inertial, depending on the specific application, such as experiments versus meteorological analyses.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on whether the Earth can be classified as an inertial frame, with some arguing it is non-inertial due to rotation, while others suggest it can be approximated as inertial in specific contexts. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the implications of acceleration and the conditions for classifying frames.

Contextual Notes

Participants note the limitations of treating the Earth as inertial due to its rotation and the varying relevance of this classification depending on the experimental or analytical context.

rudransh verma
Gold Member
Messages
1,067
Reaction score
96

I previously thought Earth is inertial frame and relative to Earth non accelerating frames are inertial too. But after watching this video, I came to know that it’s not the frame with respect to which we decide whether a frame is inertial or not. It’s the particle.
When a particle is not accelerating the frame is inertial. When it’s accelerating frame is non inertial.
But how the author is saying there is acceleration even when the net force is zero? I don’t get that part.
Also for example we take Earth and lift example. If our lift is accelerating then what does that make the earth, a non inertial frame or inertial ?
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: vcsharp2003
Physics news on Phys.org
rudransh verma said:
I previously thought Earth is inertial frame

It can't be since it is rotating. Rotating reference frames are not inertial. But sometimes we can neglect those effect, and treat frame connected with Earth as inertial, but that is an approximation.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: vcsharp2003 and vanhees71
Another very illuminating movie, one of my favorites, is

 
  • Love
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: rudransh verma and Steve4Physics
rudransh verma said:
Also for example we take Earth and lift example. If our lift is accelerating then what does that make the earth, a non inertial frame or inertial ?
Part of the skill of physics/engineering is to know how to think about a problem.

Suppose you are doing experiments in a lab’ with colliding objects on an air-track. The fact that the Earth is rotating (so is non-inertial) is irrelevant – the effects on the experimental results are too small to have any detectable effects. You are therefore justified in treating the Earth as an inertial frame.

But if you are a meteorologist analysing large-scale patterns of air flow in the atmosphere., you cannot ignore the earth’s rotation. You must treat the Earth as a non-inertial frame. (Read about Coriolis force if you are not already familiar with it.)
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: rudransh verma and vanhees71

Similar threads

  • · Replies 22 ·
Replies
22
Views
2K
  • · Replies 94 ·
4
Replies
94
Views
7K
  • · Replies 35 ·
2
Replies
35
Views
4K
  • · Replies 18 ·
Replies
18
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
5K
  • · Replies 15 ·
Replies
15
Views
2K
  • · Replies 15 ·
Replies
15
Views
3K
  • · Replies 13 ·
Replies
13
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K